128. Navigating Ruts, Creativity, and the True Meaning of Fulfillment: A Candid Conversation with Tommy and Harris

What happens when the paths we think will lead us to happiness and success end up leaving us feeling stuck and unfulfilled? Join us as we explore this question through personal stories of overcoming ruts and depression with Tommy and Harris. Their candid conversation reveals the harsh realities of feeling unproductive and the necessity of reassessing goals to find true fulfillment. You'll gain a fresh perspective on how to navigate these challenging times and emerge stronger and more resilient.

Ever wondered about the unique struggles that creative individuals face, especially during a global pandemic? This episode delves into the emotional and mental challenges that artists encounter, highlighting the isolation and routine disruptions that can amplify feelings of despair. We also challenge societal assumptions about productivity and innovation, debating the worth of creative work versus traditional forms of labor. Hear firsthand how different professions require their own kinds of creativity and resilience to not only survive but thrive.

Finally, Harris gives us a raw and gritty look into life in a shelter, drawing a stark comparison to prison life. From defending one's honor in violent confrontations to the camaraderie formed amidst hardship, Harris paints a vivid picture of survival and community. We also tackle the complex relationship between wealth and happiness, engaging in spirited debates about whether financial success truly guarantees a fulfilling life. Through these compelling narratives, this episode invites you to reflect on your own journey, values, and what it means to find happiness and fulfillment.

we on X

Chapters

• 0:00 Getting Over a Rut and Depression
• 13:06 The Creative Persona
• 24:46 Navigating Conflicting Ideals and Pursuits
• 39:43 Life in a Shelter
• 44:07 Life in a Shelter
• 47:42 Understanding Rock Bottom and Change
• 1:03:41 The Value of Money Versus Happiness
• 1:10:53 The Pursuit of Wealth and Happiness
• 1:18:51 Money and Happiness Debate
• 1:29:45 Money and Integrity Banter
• 1:36:49 Developing Control Over Your Destiny
• 1:40:29 Understanding Life Through Suffering and Risk
• 1:43:56 Wealth, Power, and Society's Judgment
• 1:50:25 Wealth and Integrity Debated

Transcript

Harris: 0:00

On this week's episode.

Tommy: 0:01

Living today. If you're not doing so well and you're in a rut, what can you do for yourself? Today is the question you should be asking yourself. And what can you do?

Toliy: 0:09

I just realized that he answered the question. You know what it is what. So all you need to reach is six figures and that's it. You think that you're going to be happy. You're good after that.

Harris: 0:18

Yeah, you know, 100, 150,000 a year. You know, everything's beachy.

Toliy: 0:22

I'm having a hard time understanding what you're saying. I'm fucking done.

Tommy: 0:26

Goodbye.

Mike: 0:28

I'd like to celebrate this moment we had the first walk-off on our podcast.

Harris: 0:33

I'm confused why the hell he took it so personal. I just stormed off man.

Mike: 0:43

Alright, guys, tommy. Tommy Present. Would you like to introduce the topic? I threw around two topics. Okay, what do you got?

Tommy: 0:51

The first. Well, karis, you know it was to get over a slump or a rut. In other words, like a block, like things are frustrating, you're tired and you go through maybe a long period of inaction, not doing nothing. Uh, and then the other one, which you were not here for I thought of how does that sound?

Mike: 1:14

first of all, well, I think you might want to do a better job at explaining the topic that you were bringing up. So, harris, if you recall that conversation that you had with Tom, could?

Harris: 1:23

you give us a better. You were talking about how did I push through? I'd say, when I was down, right, that's what you were feeling depression.

Tommy: 1:35

Let me clarify a little bit. I'll elaborate. I was just thinking today about a time in my life when I would, you know, like I would read some stuff and it would give me insight, it would influence me, but then I would feel like lonely and tired and unable to do anything and I couldn't understand why. You know, I would go and see my friends, you know, you guys know I would come in and I would talk, but I wasn't like experiencing much in terms of like movement or in terms of progress in my life.

Harris: 2:04

That's what we call depression.

Tommy: 2:06

Nothing was happening. But it took me time to. It took me I had to learn in order for me to realize that what I was doing in fact was different than what I assumed I was doing, which I assumed that reading and stuff, this insight that it was giving me was, was in fact progress. You know, I it took me time to learn that, in a way, I was looking around and I was curious and I wanted to learn stuff. And if I, if I had stuck with that, then maybe it would have been different. But there were times when I was just stuck, I didn't know what to do, you know, and I was tired and I felt lonely and depressed, maybe a little bit.

Mike: 2:47

So sounds like that is depression. Well, but based on what he's saying, if I'm hearing this correctly, you can correct me if I'm wrong but he was doing certain things which he thought that would bring a certain desired outcome, something that he was trying to achieve in his life. But the things that he were doing they were actually not bringing him whatever he was seeking. He was under the wrong impression of how to get there or where he's trying to get to, like the whole concept sounds like it was messed up and that led him to depression like it's. You, let's say, you set a goal for yourself like you want to be happy, right, and you thought that reading books and, I don't know, writing a fake book is going to make you happy.

Harris: 3:25

Go fuck yourself.

Tommy: 3:27

At that time I wasn't even thinking about writing a book.

Mike: 3:30

I'm just giving examples, Tom. It doesn't have to be that specific thing.

Tommy: 3:32

I'm saying in general to, to, to be clear, insight, like for me, is just that's just all it is Um. You know, I was learning, I was learning and what I wanted to do was learn Um.

Toliy: 3:48

But I found. I found that's it.

Tommy: 3:51

Yeah, it let. Well, the thing is, I was listening to myself, I was listening to my experiences and I was gathering from what I was, uh, what, from my living, what, what perhaps would you know, kind of um, what would interest me.

Mike: 4:05

What perhaps would you know, kind of what would interest me. He was so it sounds like in his head he created certain things that he thought was going to get him to a better place, where he was going to enjoy life, be happy, right, and because those things were actually not rooted in truth, they did not bring him that which he was seeking, but all the stuff that he was doing doing, he was doing it on his own. So he's in a way to me, at least the way I'm understanding it he realized that he thought his path was one like supposed to go a certain way, but he was under the wrong impression. But he did that for some time, I guess, and he wasn't getting the results. Like it's like you're running for 100 miles, okay, and you think you're going in the right direction, and then you're like yo, you realize you haven't gone anywhere, for example, or you've been running in the wrong direction and the right direction is actually right in front of you. It's been right in front of you the whole time.

Tommy: 4:57

Yes, and you compare it to running, which I really like. Well, you're a runner, so I had to use that. Because look, if you run a.

Toliy: 5:03

He's not a runner, but oh which I did.

Tommy: 5:04

I used to run a lot and I still do, sometimes 11 miles, right, but my relationship to. It is not a competitive one, okay, and I even had to learn that. So if you're running 100 miles and you're going nowhere, then yeah, like me, maybe you'll end up for a few months not running at all, and that's disappointing to me.

Mike: 5:24

But that's been part of my learning experience. That's because you were under the impression that running or whatever that act was whether it's running or reading, or writing or I don't- know, yes, whatever those things you put in your head that were going to bring you to where you wanted to go, what you thought was going to help you to get into a peaceful state of mind, a happy life.

Mike: 5:47

They didn't lead you there, but you spend so much energy to get there, which you never really did, but you're already exhausted from the journey, so it's like, in a way, you kind of fed up.

Tommy: 5:53

Yeah and you want to give up, exactly. I think there is something intrinsically good about learning okay, so I'll say that. And there's something intrinsically good about being healthy, so I'll say that. It's just good. Tom, I don't think we're discussing that, but no, what we're discussing is getting over a rut.

Mike: 6:14

And that. I think, requires maybe to know yourself a little bit better. I think maybe the interesting question is before how to get over a rut, right, maybe? Why do we get into a rut in the first place? And I'd love to hear what Harris has to say, since you did ask him the question of how did you get out of that depression?

Harris: 6:28

I just want to ask bottom, rock, bottom, would you say, you're out of your rut, as you call it right now?

Tommy: 6:37

I'd say I have a close relationship with my creative flow right now.

Mike: 6:41

So if you want the English version, I'll tell you yes.

Tommy: 6:47

Yes, actually, as a matter of fact. As a matter of fact, yes, I was in a rut for two weeks recently and I had to pull myself out of it and it was the strangest, most unusual, difficult, uh, sleep deprived experience that I could not explain, that I couldn't shed, I couldn't shake it, it uh, and it was actually the. I even wrote. You know, I wrote in in because I write daily and I I wrote this is just the hardest time in my life. That's the hardest time I've ever had in my life, and I couldn't, I couldn't understand it, but it was two weeks long you know I would like to read this book before you publish it, if that's all right see that now this what is what you've just said to me says to me that I'm going in the right direction.

Tommy: 7:29

To me, that's a kind of you know, that's a a sign that I'm doing what's right in my life. You're not putting us in the book, right, but yes, okay. So let me pick up where I was and I was to let Harris speak.

Tommy: 7:42

Let me pick up where I was. I was in a rut, okay, and I felt all these emotions disappointed, angry, I felt ashamed, I felt guilt, I don't know. I probably felt a lot of these things a lot of anxiety How'd you get there? A lot of nervousness, that kind of thing, how'd I get there?

Mike: 8:02

I have no idea. Nobody cares about you. How'd you get there?

Tommy: 8:05

I kept going to, you know, I kept going to the cafe where I write okay and um, and one day I decided you know what were you looking for at that cafe?

Tommy: 8:14

let me finish. Yes, one day I decided I'm just going to go home, I would like to work from home. And what happened when I got home? Um, it was like I. And what happened when I got home? It was like I unplugged entirely and I found that for two weeks I couldn't do anything that I liked at all. So I was stuck yeah, I was really stuck and feeling depressed and very angry and I was lashing out in a way and I was behaving in ways I couldn't explain. You know, I was having a lot of, you know, having a kind of tantrum, and you know, I kind of uh, you know, I had a kind of conflict, in a way, with my mom and I told her, you know, I, I would like to, like, just be left alone, you know, and it was very, it was very unusual, but what I did to to change this was, um, you know, I started thinking, uh, simple pleasure, you know, like just doing one thing doing. You know it's strange.

Mike: 9:09

Wait, are you telling us the answer how to get out of?

Tommy: 9:11

depression. What I'm trying to say, what is true, the truth is, is that I have a routine that I follow and that routine usually works and then one day that routine did not work.

Mike: 9:20

Well, I don't think it's actually. I don't think it actually works. I don't think it ever actually I don't think it actually works. I don't think it ever worked. I think you've been uh, running amok. Oh, harris has hand up. Why don't we let harris chime in? This is gonna be the worst podcast I'm telling you it's gonna be the best.

John: 9:32

It's gonna be the best it's actually the worst everybody's gonna be listening who everybody's gonna be listening.

Harris: 9:37

This is a fire podcast so, in my opinion, the only way to get out of what I'm going to call a depression, because that's exactly what it is and what it sounds like.

Toliy: 9:50

Right and depression is two different things, right.

Harris: 9:53

Everything you described is basically giving me the opinion of depression, because I've been through depression for most of my damn life. You need to find your motivation. Your motivation in my opinion right is writing this book, but the book cannot consume your life. You need to get out. You need to hang out with your friends, you need to hang out with normal people and not close your yeah, absolutely.

Mike: 10:22

But I think so. What's more interesting is how did how did he he or anybody who's gotten into this depression right? There's two things that I want to understand, right? My first question is how do you not get into one right? And the way tom is talking, he seems like he knows some things, but he doesn't. He doesn't. So when do you reach the point and you say you know what? Like I'm tired, I'm depressed, I don't know anything. I need help. I don't have the answers.

Harris: 10:52

Well, let's call it rock bottom. Okay, my rock bottom. Okay, how'd you get there? How'd I get there? It was COVID-19. I was load from my job, basically let go, okay. Uh, I had to move back to new york. Uh, basically, I really didn't have anywhere to go at the time because covid19 risked people getting seriously ill, so I went into the shelter. That was my rock bottom so for nine months. And how did you know that was rock bottom? Because, uh, after the first two weeks I I felt like shit. I didn't want to do shit. And you know I felt like shit. You know I was like how the hell could I let myself get to this point? You know I was shitting on myself and I was in that for nine months.

Mike: 11:37

You didn't see this coming, Like I didn't. You know, Obviously, COVID-19,. I know you didn't see that coming.

Harris: 11:43

When I was at the airport we started hearing the rumblings and of course our manager was saying oh, it's the Chinese people coming over and they're bringing the COVID-19. And we didn't know that for sure. But they're saying you know, watch out yeah. They're saying watch out for the China virus. It's what everyone thought. But that happened. And when I was in the shelter, like I never pictured myself being, at that point, but that was my rock bottom.

Harris: 12:12

Okay, I guess the one thing that kept pushing me was my family and friends telling me to keep pushing, don't fucking give up. Because that's what I was doing. I was like you know, I just want to give up. This is it. You know, this is where I'm going to be for the rest of my life. That's how I was was feeling, and they just kept telling me keep pushing, don't give up. And you know, you just need motivation to get out there and do something.

Tommy: 12:34

Yeah, I would say my experience was a little opposite from yours, because I'm with my family, while you were sort of like removed in an outside position from your family. What do you think?

Mike: 12:45

I'm home, you know I have my parents I'd love to hear what john has to say have you ever experienced depression, john? Or that doesn't affect you? No, it doesn't affect me, is it? Is there a reason why?

Tommy: 12:57

no okay, okay, tom yeah, I'm sorry I'm putting up with these two hot tomatoes over here.

Harris: 13:06

It wasn't by anyone's choice that I ended up in the shelter. We were in a pandemic.

Mike: 13:11

But the choices that you made prior to that put you in. Did you have savings when?

Tommy: 13:16

you lost your job. I don't know if rock bottom is the same.

Mike: 13:19

You were living. Text to text, rock bottom might be different than a rut. Well, I think the rock bottom is an important thing. The point of this it might not.

Harris: 13:27

Might not even exist. The point is, this is okay. You had all the similarities of depression. The problem was okay. You were in my opinion, you were letting your book consume you, correct?

Toliy: 13:39

no, I couldn't explain it honestly and I still don't know if I can't explain how I got saying that a rut and uh and uh depression is the same thing, or well, a rut is a small version of depression um so okay, so I'll say this hold on, hold on.

Mike: 13:53

Let me explain, let me go for a little bit.

Tommy: 13:55

All right, if you do that, I'm gonna leave oh, okay, yeah I love this.

Toliy: 13:59

This is what crazy makers do. They create the dramas, oh you won't.

Harris: 14:03

We need a little drama with this podcast. Okay, this is becoming a little down. It's a timing podcast.

Tommy: 14:07

I'll say this. I'll say this I had reasons for not working at the cafe and I had expectations of what would happen if I saved my money and my time and I stayed home and I sort of mentally prepared myself for that. But what happened was the routine was actually. It was a good flow. It was important to me I would spend a few hours outside. I'd come home and I was tired, but I would actually settle into a chair and I would get comfortable and I would read. But when I decided to stay home and I thought that this would benefit me, somehow I couldn't actually execute it and I ended up feeling stuck. I ended up feeling a lot of pressure to I don't know, to sort of abandon. I don't know. I just kind of abandoned what I was doing before.

Harris: 14:52

So in my opinion, you had a temporary depression episode.

Tommy: 14:58

Maybe he had an episode. Yeah, probably, yeah, probably.

Mike: 15:03

If I talk to an expert maybe they'll say it. But what if it's been lasting for the last 20 years? Then what would you say to that?

Harris: 15:08

Then he's had depression for all his damn life. Yeah, is this the first time you ever had this feeling?

Tommy: 15:18

Yeah, of this magnitude, absolutely.

Harris: 15:20

Of this magnitude. But was there a different magnitude? It was bad.

Tommy: 15:24

It was low and it was bad.

Harris: 15:25

But have you ever felt like these?

Tommy: 15:28

feelings before.

Tommy: 15:29

No See, here's the thing. I did mention that when I was younger I was curious about learning, and that's usually how I would deal with things, to deal with anxiety. I go and pick up something and I find the answers. I find the answers, but sometimes the answer can't just come, it just can't, it can't be delivered immediately. Do you see what I'm saying? So. So I tried to do that, but I was unable to do that and I found myself very depressed because I couldn't find the answers anywhere, um, and I couldn't understand what was happening I'd like to hear uh toli's opinion on anything that tommy has said and you can also say he hasn't said anything either.

Toliy: 16:03

I'm getting confused here. I would say that I'm not understanding at all what's going on.

Mike: 16:09

I think Tom is.

Tommy: 16:12

I empathize with that, because you guys don't sit and write daily.

Mike: 16:17

Your job is not to Okay there's where we're going with this.

Tommy: 16:19

Got it.

Mike: 16:20

To write any. You guys are not writers, so you wouldn't understand what it feels to be depressed to write any. You guys are not writers, so you wouldn't understand what it feels to be depressed so are we going back to this book which, if we go into it.

Tommy: 16:28

Obviously, you know what I think is. What I think is relevant here is that when you live a life as a creative, you have to feel your way around oh, tommy hasn't been on the podcast for a while. What that means is you have to accept that sometimes routine is just not going to cut it.

Toliy: 16:43

What do you mean? You live your life as a creative.

Mike: 16:46

Yeah, Tom, you nap 80 hours a day.

Toliy: 16:48

Yeah, that's an assumption.

Tommy: 16:51

I don't think you should make assumptions.

Toliy: 16:54

Why are you saying that you live a life as a creative and we don't?

Tommy: 16:58

But perhaps you do have creative moments, and I appreciate that he creates magic every day.

Harris: 17:01

I would love to hear about them as a matter of fact, instead of writing it in a book, he's telling it to people.

Tommy: 17:07

I can already tell Aldor's going to love this episode. He damn right is yes, because you're basically telling him everyone at our company is not creative.

John: 17:15

All the clues are coming together, you two have run amok. This guy. You've run amok, at least.

Tommy: 17:26

Remember.

Harris: 17:26

You've run amok.

Tommy: 17:27

I'm going to repeat it for a third time you have run amok. Oh, hold up.

Harris: 17:29

You've gone amok. How does? It feel you just wait, because I'm going to defend Tully here for a minute. Have you ever seen Tully work?

Tommy: 17:41

How would you define work?

Harris: 17:43

Have you ever been in the office when he's talking to a customer and closing a deal?

Tommy: 17:49

And where is this going? If I do know the answer, how will it help?

Harris: 17:53

Because if you've ever seen it, then you would know he does have creativity.

Tommy: 17:58

How do you feel about that, Tully? How do you feel that he just dropped the C word on you?

Toliy: 18:03

I feel that you don dropped the c word on you. I feel that and no, I do.

Mike: 18:05

No, I do not feel that and no, I do not offended.

Tommy: 18:07

No, no, no no, no, I do not mean cunt.

Mike: 18:11

Do you feel offended that you're being called creative, even because then it would associate you with tom, or no?

Toliy: 18:16

me. Yeah, no, I feel I. I feel not that I actually feel offended. Yeah, let's get the record straight. Yeah, I definitely find it funny that Tom continues to have this ploy that he's a creative and he lives a particular lifestyle, that he does something different than the average person does. That I'm not really understanding.

Mike: 18:37

Well, that's part of the question that I'm interested in is this whole thing, this narrative that we write for ourselves, this creative persona that he created for himself. He thinks that this is going to make him happy, but I disagree with that, because the way he thinks he's going to get there, it's not. First of all, I'm not sure if it's achievable you don't even have to disagree with it.

Toliy: 18:58

Right like, like, like, uh like. The results show for themselves, and those are existent, regardless of how you feel about the situation. Right Like, the actions lead you to seeing something like in a particular way. So I'm not even thinking that necessarily. Is you thinking this? It's you seeing what's happening and then making a conclusion.

Mike: 19:19

Well, yeah, based on Tom's book that he's been writing for three years, that we've never seen.

Toliy: 19:24

Yeah, but it's four years, like on and off Someone who's writing a book or someone who's doing sales Tom's book that he's been writing for three years, that we've never seen Four years On and off. Someone who's writing a book, someone, who's doing sales, someone who's doing plumbing, someone who's doing something else? Age back, yeah, someone who's just eating all day.

Mike: 19:36

Eating all day and drinking unlimited coffees.

Toliy: 19:38

With green hair. Everything can be done with creativity and, like everyone, like anyone is, is, I guess, so-called like how would you define creativity so?

Mike: 19:51

would you say that totally? Would you say that creativity is just a another word for bullshitter?

Tommy: 19:57

what I want to know is what I want to know from totally is how do you define?

Toliy: 20:00

creativity. Talk in the way that, like anyone needs, like anyone that needs to talk in the way that anyone needs, anyone that needs to tell others that they're creative. They are not creative.

Tommy: 20:10

Okay, that was a great quote. I've written one of yours down and maybe I won't add it to my phone.

Harris: 20:15

I have to ask a question. Can you at least tell us this? What is this?

Tommy: 20:21

book about. I'm writing a memoir. Harris, there you go, and when you get that facial expression from somebody, what is this book? About I'm writing a memoir, harris, that's it. There you go and see when you get that facial expression from somebody, when you tell them what you're doing then you understand where you stand.

Mike: 20:33

You understand because they don't understand what you said.

Harris: 20:35

So you're writing about your life, correct? I better not be in that damn book.

Tommy: 20:41

You're the main character.

Harris: 20:42

Hold on.

Toliy: 20:45

You're the love of main character. Hold on.

Tommy: 20:46

Hold on one second, guys. I understand the reason.

Toliy: 20:50

This is a non-existent book.

Tommy: 20:51

When you tell somebody who is blocked as a creative, who is a blocked creative, that you're interested in creativity. It threatens them. It threatens their existence.

Toliy: 21:00

I'm not threatened right now. Harris' understanding of life. I think it's people who talk about creativity and think that they're creative and try to let others know that they're doing something creative, I think they're offended because they're actually not creative.

Tommy: 21:13

How do you define your creativity?

Toliy: 21:15

And they're not getting the feedback from the outside world to validate that they're actually creative. I think you're just babbling here.

Tommy: 21:20

You're yapping.

Harris: 21:22

You know what you're yapping about.

Tommy: 21:23

You're getting defensive right now you're yapping about, your favorite thing to do is yap about people just do what people think he's getting defensive. I'm used to this but you won't answer to a question. You won't allow me to pose a question to you, which is how are you creative and what do you think is creative? You leave the burden on everybody else to figure that out who told you that creativity means anything?

Mike: 21:48

what I'm saying.

Tommy: 21:50

What I would like to know is what creativity is.

Harris: 21:53

It's absolutely nothing, it's everything you're writing a new game of thrones creativity is creating.

Mike: 21:59

Yeah, I just took a shit.

Tommy: 22:00

Yeah, yeah, okay, so in what relationship do you have to that action at all? Well, I mean like when do you create? When was the last time you created something?

Toliy: 22:10

I create. I mean, I'm creating stuff right now.

Tommy: 22:14

You're creating by what? By speaking. So you're being an art. You're being an art like Tommy.

Harris: 22:20

Oh shit. Okay, great.

Tommy: 22:22

I appreciate that I'm looking at your body language.

Harris: 22:24

I'm looking at how you Are you being like Tommy Me? Yeah?

Tommy: 22:28

He just said you're being like.

Harris: 22:29

Tommy.

Tommy: 22:30

He's being a pond turtle the way I can see him right now is he's?

Harris: 22:35

Yeah, he's poking up his head here and there. What the hell is a pond turtle?

Tommy: 22:39

A turtle that swims in a pond, like the one I saw yesterday, spokes up his head. He's like, hey, the day is over, how's everybody doing? And then he just drops back in. Oh shit.

Harris: 22:49

What kind of mushrooms were you on you?

Tommy: 22:52

spoke to him right, I think Karis is a blocked creative, so this is an appropriate topic, because you speak in ways that are comedic and funny and you wait for, you're a kind of silent observer, and then you just pop in and you, you've got something funny creativity that is, I think I could be a comedian right now I think you already are.

Mike: 23:10

I don't think so.

Harris: 23:10

I think we should put me on a stage and let everyone okay, yeah, what do you?

Tommy: 23:14

think we're doing right now?

Harris: 23:14

I'm hearing things right now, no, but I think you should put me a book me a night in new york city, man, yeah nobody's coming, nobody's gonna go there yeah, they are just me, mike Nike actually this podcast is creative, so totally, you didn't even have that in mind really wow, totally so dumb.

John: 23:30

Yeah, I know boo, this man, this creative thing. So let me ask you where, where?

Tommy: 23:37

yeah, you are totally where. In terms of where, in terms of creativity, does this podcast exist?

Toliy: 23:43

wait, we're switching the topic For you when, in terms of creativity, does this podcast exist? I'm not sure what that means.

Tommy: 23:48

Yeah, where do they link? Where's the link here for you For?

Mike: 23:51

what? On a scale of 1 to 10 in creativity, how creative is this podcast? No, that's not what I'm asking. No, that's not what I'm asking what?

Tommy: 23:57

are you asking what I'm in any way creative doing this podcast? Where does it exist for you in your mind?

Toliy: 24:05

You would have to define creativity. I'm not sure what that means. Where does it exist in your mind?

Tommy: 24:09

Correct. Why do you think I listen to this podcast? Because I like to learn. I value learning. I value creativity.

Toliy: 24:22

What you guys have come up with the best podcast in the world what you guys have come up with.

Tommy: 24:25

The best podcast in the world, right? What you guys have come up with is a creative thing to sit and talk about things in real life. I think it's meaningful, I think it's a creative thing. So this, in fact, it exists in a creative realm. It exists among many, many, many things you can listen to on the internet, I mean everything that we do is creative Eating, pooping sleeping. I don't know about that. I don't know what you consider being creative. I consider being creative something completely different. Pretty sure.

Tommy: 24:54

I've picked up rocks recently I've gone exploring and I've picked up rocks and brought them home Rocks that I like. That's a creative thing.

Mike: 25:01

But that's creative.

Tommy: 25:02

to you it doesn't mean anybody else actually cares about it. It's generally in general. It is a creative thing. I was picking up rocks creatively.

Mike: 25:10

I think for Tommy that's creativity for him.

Harris: 25:13

Were you making something with those rocks?

Mike: 25:15

He was eating them. Okay, so that was it.

Tommy: 25:18

So you know here, actually, my roommate. He came up with a really good example. He was teaching a philosophy class. He's a professor in Turkey. He was talking about the raisins sort of cycle, like where it has come from. It's come from India or wherever it's come from. It's come from a country of origin and it was a grape and it was shipped on a certain ship and it came and arrived in a certain warehouse and it was dried in a certain place and it was packaged and it was sold and it was distributed and it reached a home and what you hold in your hand is a creation. As a result of all this happened, I got it and this is what it means for something to have a being, for it to have meaning. That's kind of what it is.

Mike: 26:03

Tom, you remember when Conor McGregor said to Nate Diaz what he said?

Tommy: 26:08

no, but um, I do remember an old, I do remember an old joke he said.

Mike: 26:17

What did he say? Give me my coffee. Something like that. I understood it. Okay, I'll take it fine. Okay, something you said to me earlier this week, something like that I understood it Okay. I'll take it Fine. Okay, toby. Yeah, something you said to me earlier this week. Yep, elon Musk said that his son is dead, and his son is dead because the woke mind virus took over his brain.

Tommy: 26:40

You heard, mike, are you done babbling or are you still trying to filibuster this bullshit? Totally, you heard.

Mike: 26:44

Yes, I hear you. Is that what's happening to Tom? The woke mind virus is taking over his brain, this whole creativity train that he's on, this whole thing that he created for himself 100%.

Tommy: 26:56

Guys, all I can say is this my current life and my ideal life have lately been in conflict. Which ones, my current life and my ideal life, have been in conflict?

Mike: 27:08

Do you?

Tommy: 27:09

know why or not, I found myself at times wanting things that I cannot have and feeling in conflict with my current self, with my current experience, because I like to fantasize about things that I really can't have.

Mike: 27:23

So you're saying you're not living in reality.

Tommy: 27:25

Okay, fair enough in some ways, I am in conflict with not living in reality. Yeah, but uh, who do you blame it on? It's not about blame, it's about being blocked. It's about who's blocking you blame it's about being blocked?

Mike: 27:36

Who's?

Tommy: 27:36

blocking you why?

Mike: 27:37

Because it makes me feel Democrats, or Republicans.

Tommy: 27:39

It makes me feel, it gives me a shot of, you know, of kind of pleasure to think about something that I might be able to get but I don't need, because it's outside of my concerns. It's outside of what I actually do need, which is to continue working and growing as a creative. And I'm trying, I want, I would like to become a writer and I've kind of um, the truth is that I've bounced around between this thing and the other thing, uh, trying to balance two different aspects, trying trying to balance two, two different pursuits, when, in fact, the one pursuit, um, the one thing that does matter to me, which if comes from the podcast where we said, well, and I talked about going to the national guard and I was curious about what I should do and trying to figure out how I can have a huge impact on the world, and all the shit Ideals, guys, ideals, yeah this is gonna same thing.

Mike: 28:36

Tommy has created these ideas for himself. It can be a fucking car.

Tommy: 28:41

It can be money, it can be influence, it can be you know, it can be fame, it can be a lot of things. Ideals they can easily destroy pursuit. And the question is what are your goals and how do you, you know, find a way to?

Harris: 28:59

that's not the question are you writing this book to get famous?

Tommy: 29:03

and make your and make your life a little bit better today because it's too egotistical to sit and do nothing, because you just said fame.

Harris: 29:09

So I'm wondering is this memoir of yours about fame?

Tommy: 29:14

no, I, I just explained it, harrison. If you were listening, you would understand I'm saying, I'm saying that that okay.

Tommy: 29:21

So let me explain so today, living today, if you're not doing so well and you're in a rut, what can you do for yourself? Today is the question you should be asking yourself. And what can you do, and what? What can you do If you set a goal, if your goal is not a problem of the conflict between your current and your, let's say, your future self or whatever, and it's a realistic goal, like a goal that you can actually reasonably pursue.

Toliy: 29:56

Tom didn't answer the question.

Mike: 29:58

Which question?

Toliy: 30:00

If you're in a rut, like, for example. His original question is that, if you're in a rut, how do you get out of the rut? I just realized that he answered the question.

Mike: 30:09

It took 20 minutes. You know what it is. Keep going deeper into the rut.

Toliy: 30:15

Become a creative. No, he actually answered it. He did. How long have we been recording 30? It'll take you 30 minutes. If you listen to this podcast for 30 minutes, you'll realize you're not really the rut okay, guys, finishing thoughts should we go eat pizza right now alright, guys, that's it.

Tommy: 30:39

I'm fucking done.

Toliy: 30:41

I'm fucking done.

Tommy: 30:45

I am fucking Mark my words. I am fucking, I'm fucking done, goodbye.

Mike: 30:54

See you later. Thank you very much. I'm going home to See you later. Thank you, tom, for visiting.

Harris: 31:02

And sharing your thoughts. You're taking this too seriously. Dude Yo listen. You're taking this too seriously. What the hell just happened. Where is this?

Tommy: 31:12

mofo going. I'd like to celebrate this moment.

Mike: 31:16

I'd like to celebrate this moment. I'd like to celebrate this moment.

Toliy: 31:20

We had the first walk off on our podcast yeah, on behalf of Tom. This is what just happened.

Guest: 31:29

Mr Madison, what you just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Harris: 32:00

That's right, tom. May God have mercy on your soul. That's right, tom. May God have mercy on your soul. So what do you think, harris? I'm confused why the hell he took it so personal. I just stormed off man. Well, I think he just said he's not in the rut anymore and when Anatoly pointed that out, he left.

Mike: 32:14

I think, tom is not really liking. Tom was in the rut anymore. I went and it totally pointed that out. He, he left. I Think Tom is not really. I'm saying if you listen to this podcast for 30 minutes, you'll realize yeah, the thing is, tom, he was saying a lot of stuff. He came to you to ask you, but he ended up telling you everything which didn't make any sense, and then he left because it totally offended him he was reading the book.

Toliy: 32:42

Tom has a very specific strategy. He's going to throw a lot of words at you in an attempt to confuse you, for you just to nod your head and act like you understand. But you don't understand a word he's saying.

Harris: 32:57

And then he leaves.

Toliy: 32:59

And then, when there's a realization of that, he leaves. No, he'll point out, that's what happened. So if you said something like Tom, that shit was woke, he would've stayed why didn't you say that? Yeah, we asked you. What do you think you should've been like yo, tom? That makes a lot of sense. That makes a lot of sense. You got a good point.

Harris: 33:20

No, I feel like he wants to be the smartest man in the room. You know what I mean.

Mike: 33:23

Well, I mean listen, we can't speak for him but we could definitely.

Harris: 33:32

I mean the moment I pointed something out, he goes you just don't understand creativity oh, I think that's the whole point.

Mike: 33:39

When you use those kind of words, you make it like, oh, you're kind of more in the offensive thing, like you just don't understand, you know, which is very everyone's creative in their own damn way, in my opinion yeah, but the thing is, creativity doesn't mean shit.

Mike: 33:56

Nope, who cares if you're creative or not. You got a life to live, you know. You got to figure it out and try to be happy. Yeah, I hear that. You know I'm not sure what role creativity plays, and it plays a lot in his role. Well, exactly, and I think that's why he's stuck and where he's at, where he's stuck on his creativity, this book, and then he gets into this depression.

Harris: 34:22

So, Mike, you would know this. Is he really writing the book?

Mike: 34:25

His book of three years? I have no idea, but if I was to take a wild guess, probably not, I don't think he's writing the book that's like 3 years right 4. He said alright, so you guys want to discuss the question now that Tom has left the room.

Harris: 34:41

The book mountain virus after all this, can you remind me what the question was?

Mike: 34:45

well, I think the question is it's around rock bottom. How do we get there? Why do we get there? How do we get out of it? That's like you know, three questions in one. Why do people get into this? Probably?

Harris: 35:02

I'd say most of the time they get themselves into it.

Mike: 35:08

And how do you get yourself into this? Because you're not going to, obviously nobody's going to say you know what? I want to suffer as much as possible. I want to hit rock bottom.

Harris: 35:16

I guess several things have to happen in your life to get to that point. It's different for everyone. What stuff that is? Like me, I guess. I lost my job, Became homeless, Okay, and basically at the point almost gave up. Like I said, it's different for everybody. Right, it can happen.

Mike: 35:39

Several things happen when you say you almost gave up, like what does that look like? What does that mean?

Harris: 35:45

It means I didn't want to fight anymore. You know I didn't want to. You felt defeated, yeah.

Mike: 35:50

Completely. You wanted to give up, like you had no desire to keep on pushing forward.

Harris: 36:00

Yeah, it was out of my. I don't want to say reach, I guess out of my sight. I'm not sure what that means.

Mike: 36:06

I couldn't see a future past the point I was currently at. So you were in such a depression that you had no desire to keep pushing forward. Yeah, why do you think that was pushing forward? Yeah, why do?

Harris: 36:14

you think that was Because I was in a shelter with a bunch of people that I was nothing like.

Mike: 36:27

But, like the question to me is right, maybe totally can chime in, or John, because he's been, he's been, he's been very quiet, but he's been saying a lot.

Harris: 36:34

It turned into my mind that maybe I belonged here you know what I'm saying. Maybe I deserve this. Oh, this is the feeling that you felt Like after, During, During. I was there oh during and after. Well, after I got out, it kind of went away because life started to get a little back to normal, but still difficult. It kind of went away because life started to get a little back to normal but still difficult.

Mike: 36:58

But and why did you feel like that you deserve to be there? Why did you come up with that conclusion?

Harris: 37:06

You know, I was just there. It got past a couple months and I heard stories of other people that were there and all of them basically did shit that they deserve to be there. So in my mind I'm like maybe I fucking did too.

Mike: 37:21

But did you feel like you were doing a lot of stupid stuff and making mistakes in retrospect? In the moment I don't think you were like, oh, this is a terrible idea, let me go do it right when I was in there, I'd say I became a person that really nobody recognized while I was in there.

Harris: 37:41

Right, I blended in with my surroundings. Okay, I became how do I put it? A G, as some people call it, a wannabe G. You acted tough, yes, what you had to do, pretending it was a fight for survival.

Mike: 38:03

Okay, how did you know this? Like this is the rules of engagement.

Harris: 38:08

Well, there's a lot of violence in New York City shelters. It's a major problem, one of the most dangerous shelter systems in America. You have gangs, different shit, people coming out of prison that can't go home because there's felons that live in their house. They go there. You had several times where the FBI showed up, secret Service parole officers checking in fights to the point where people die in there and the bodies of the deceased sit there for five hours before the coroner shows up. Really, no one watching over it. This person is just laying there. Oh okay, so I turned into something as a, I guess, shield, right? Uh, it felt like prison.

Harris: 39:02

I guess I could say okay I don't have any experience with prison, but you would like to have some.

Mike: 39:11

No, oh, you wouldn't, okay, oh you want to.

John: 39:13

No.

Mike: 39:13

Okay.

Harris: 39:16

Okay. So I got to a point where I went down Mm-hmm and I didn't feel like I could pull myself out Mm-hmm. But I had family members, friends they keep telling me to push, push, this is not the end of the road. For you, there's light at the end of the tunnel, mm-hmm. And for you, uh, there's light at the end of the tunnel. And my mom used to say you know, god, god has plans for you. It's not to sit here. And at that point I was like you know, I don't believe in god anymore.

Toliy: 39:43

like what is he just up there watching, having a good time, yeah, while you're suffering, yeah, okay when, harris, could you, um, could you like, act out what it was like being like a g, like like?

Mike: 40:02

you wore a do-rag or no? Fuck you man, word by word what?

Toliy: 40:07

what would you do, though? Like what? What would your like? What's the life of a g like?

Harris: 40:11

a do-rag, I've had to fight.

Toliy: 40:14

Okay, in there it's fight or be prey basically yeah, but did you have any like lines like no, there was no lines, it was basically just violent so if someone said something to you, what would you tell him back? He would just tell him he would eat him no you can't.

Harris: 40:30

If someone said something to you, yeah, like crossed a line, you had to stand your ground, and you'd be like say that to my fucking face.

Toliy: 40:39

No, but like can you say it in the same way that you would say it in the shelter?

Harris: 40:44

I'm telling you right now If someone said to me something that crossed the line, say that to my fucking face. We can either go at it right here or do it away from the fucking cameras in the bathroom and fucking fight it out right now.

Mike: 40:56

And you've done this? How many?

John: 40:57

times, several times, how many times have you?

Mike: 40:58

What did they say to you to get you to this thing?

Harris: 41:01

Across the line, like what A lot of times it'd be. People observe certain things, like if you're on the phone with someone. At the time I had a girlfriend, liar. What was his name? The fuck you at the time she, okay. We'd video chat and someone came up to me and said something that crossed the line with her. I'm not gonna say what it is, but why not? What's the problem? Just say they called her a fat ass. Uh, blah, blah, blah, and I at that point.

Mike: 41:35

That was the one time I went.

Harris: 41:37

I went swinging where you started swinging. Right away he texted me. I came running into the fucking dorm and just went at him. Uh, just fucking went at him and uh, it just broke out.

Mike: 41:49

Uh, his boys jumped in, my friends jumped in, uh, well, you guys, you had friends over there in the thing I did.

Harris: 41:58

They were all hardworking guys that all didn't belong there, but COVID happened.

Tommy: 42:03

They got kicked out of their apartments.

Harris: 42:05

We stayed together. Anyway, their friends started jumping in, my friends started jumping in. It just broke out until what they call the shelter police. They're literally called police for the shelter system in New York City.

Toliy: 42:21

So you lived the life of a G.

Harris: 42:25

For a short time. Yes, I had a black eye. Everyone was a little fucked up.

Mike: 42:33

You got it painted on before you went in. I ended up with a black guy. The guy I was fighting had a a little fucked up. You got it painted on before you went in.

Harris: 42:37

Sure fuck you, dude. I ended up with a black guy the guy.

Toliy: 42:39

I was fighting had a busted up lip.

Harris: 42:40

The guy he's already lying, the guy I busted, the guy I was fighting had a busted up lip, a little cut, but that could have turned even worse, basically. So that could have turned even worse, basically.

Mike: 42:54

So how many fights did?

Harris: 42:55

you get into. While you were in the system, knives came out, shit like that, knives. Yeah, they threw a knife at you. No, oh, I said it could have ended like that. Oh, okay, okay, I was in three altercations and you lost all three. No, because a lot of times it turned into friends jumping in. Oh no, because a lot of times it turned into friends jumping in.

John: 43:17

Oh, so my friends would jump in the person's friends I'm fighting would jump in.

Harris: 43:21

It just turned into a group fight.

Toliy: 43:24

Would you guys fight in the Keddie pool typically? What is wrong with you? I thought you had an inflatable pool.

Harris: 43:31

There was like 5 dorms In this shelter, okay, and each dorm, I'd say, would house 75 men Did you have a nickname Like Harry Harris or like no? Everyone in there called me Shoes. No one Shoes he had no shoes, shoes, shoes, the Roos Shoes.

Mike: 43:53

How many people did you share your bed with? Fuck you, dude, all of shoes, the ruse. How many people did you share your bed with? Fuck you all of the guys fuck you.

Harris: 43:58

But uh, you know, it was just a very violent place. Things could pop off.

Mike: 44:07

Did you have a shank and didn't you pillow?

Harris: 44:09

I had a shank underneath my locker actually your locker.

Mike: 44:13

You stayed in a YMCA. No, each shelter had a locker underneath my locker actually your locker? Wait, you stayed in a YMCA.

Harris: 44:16

No, what? It's all a lie. Each shelter had a locker.

Mike: 44:19

That's crazy. What's your combination?

Harris: 44:22

Each section of the dorm had about, I'd say, 10 beds set up next to each other.

Toliy: 44:27

Why did you make?

Harris: 44:28

the shank out of it. I stole someone else's locker after they left the shelter and I made a wall against my around my bed. I had a wall next to mine in the window my bed and I built the wall that was brent's.

Toliy: 44:40

Don't say build the wall, I'm gonna leave yeah, have some respect please, please, that's offensive right, okay if we were at the shelter, we would go in the kiddie pool right now naked.

John: 44:52

There's no kiddie pool. We now Naked.

Harris: 44:53

There's no kiddie pool. We had like somewhat of a yard Right it was.

Mike: 44:59

This was in a hotel. No, this was in the Trump Tower.

Harris: 45:01

This was at the drama club this place. You can look it up. It's called Schwartz Assessment Center.

Toliy: 45:07

Schwartz, you had a barbecue in the yard.

Harris: 45:11

No, we did not. No, barbie.

Mike: 45:13

No, we did not. No, barbie, no, what kind of amenities did you guys have?

Harris: 45:15

There was a lot of drugs in there.

Mike: 45:17

Was there housekeeping service? They would come and clean your bed every day. No, okay.

Harris: 45:21

They do bed checks. It was literally like a fucking prison. They do bed checks. Basically, you had to stand at your bed, make sure you were there, and if you're not there you could lose your bed. Like a military thing, it's more like a jail. They come three times a day.

John: 45:37

Did you get one phone call? Huh, did you get one phone call?

Toliy: 45:42

No Wait, who comes three times a day?

Harris: 45:44

There's employees at the shelter that came to make sure you were at your bed. If not, you would lose your bed and someone else would take it. They would check this three times a day three times at night. Yeah, oh, at night okay eight o'clock, ten o'clock and 2 30 am okay, so okay, it was very, you were like a bandana you liked it around your knee. No, I did not like it. I made some very good friends there, though.

Mike: 46:17

Green, oh yeah, the fake Green oh the fake guy, yeah, how would you stop it?

Harris: 46:22

Green Green had my back wait, I thought he was.

Mike: 46:27

You know him from Fairlawn no Green.

Harris: 46:29

I met in the shelter Jungle the Jungle. Jungle Beats I'll pull him up right now.

Toliy: 46:35

Jungle Juice, did you Jungle, the jungle Jungle beats. I'll pull them up right now. Jungle juice, did you ever fight? In your underwear only?

Tommy: 46:39

What is wrong with?

John: 46:41

you.

Harris: 46:42

Probably yes.

Mike: 46:43

No, okay, alright, harris, listen, if this is the made up story you're going with, I like it. Tell up the made up stories right now.

Harris: 46:52

Sure, fuck you. Okay, let me see when is he at what?

Mike: 46:58

are you going to call him now to verify his story? No oh, get him a microphone Green Green, like green thumb. He's a gardener. Where's Jungle? Harris, stop moaning over there Anyway while Harris is trying to make up a fake contact he's getting on Google Maps. So, john, do you believe that he had rock bottom in that time in his life? Yes, you did. You do believe. Why do you think so? Like what made you you know? Did you guys? Were you guys in contact at the time? Because you guys known each other?

Harris: 47:31

for I think I kind of hid everything from John. Well, I didn't know until later. Yeah, he didn't know until he met Green, because at that point I guess we both kind of spilled the beans to him. But you FaceTimed me during that, right? Yeah, I did, but I didn't show you the dorms. I was sitting Florida first, and then I went back to New York, then I moved to Nebraska. Oh, then you moved to Nebraska. Yeah, john took me. No, I didn't, not you, schuster, oh. Okay.

Toliy: 48:08

Yeah, but I think that these rock bottoms are fake news.

Mike: 48:12

Fuck you. In what sense Tully fake news? In what sense Tully what? In what sense?

Toliy: 48:15

Well, because some of them we were talking about earlier in the week. But the rock bottoms are like what you potentially define as a shitty situation for the person who you are at the moment. Okay, but over time those rock bottoms could shift, like if you get out of that and then you improve and then something else happens, like you then have a new rock bottom okay but I I think it's very hard to define these because um well, yeah, but the thing, but what you're saying totally is, rock bottoms are different for everybody.

Toliy: 48:58

Well, no, everybody has a different low in pain tolerance the rock bottoms are defined by the person, but they're only defined as to what they can fathom that rock bottom to be so like if you right now tell me what would be your rock bottom right now, like I think that there's a rock bottom below that. But that's not what like your imagination.

Mike: 49:22

Your imagination tells you that, like that, like that might be what rock bottom would look like so how does a person like, uh, maybe harris hasn't reached a turning point where he wants to live his life a different way, or you know, or maybe he has, I don't know, the jury's out on that. But how does somebody change?

Toliy: 49:42

their lives like I.

Toliy: 49:43

I don't think it can be done from the motivation of the rock bottom, because that rock bottom is a painful place and, like we were speaking earlier in the week about desperation, yeah, the if.

Toliy: 49:55

If you're in that place, you're a very desperate person and that desperate. If you want to call it fuel, right, it's very, uh, powerful fuel but, um, it's not very efficient. So if you want to compare it to flying or driving or using the fuel, it's like a thousand gallons a second to operate, so it's not very sustainable. So, if you use that fuel, I think it will work. But those kinds of things, those things happen outside of that really bad pain period, because only that fuel of like, of like you educating yourself, you willing to stay humble, you willing to like learn, you willing to see things through, you having patience, you having those kinds of qualities, to me are the only thing that's probably possible to withstand the effort it takes and the type of fuel it takes to make a meaningful change, yeah, but what you're talking about it seems like a more advanced level of kind of like commitment to that.

Toliy: 51:15

Well, that's just more of a depiction of what's actually happening. Right, it's not that like every person has to understand that, um, but it still is happening okay um, but change takes time yeah, but as far as again the these like rock bottoms, stuff like that, like at that point that might have been his rock bottom right right now it might be something else well, yeah the. Thing is rock bottoms.

Mike: 51:43

They happen in multiple areas and multiple facets of life.

Toliy: 51:47

That might have been his rock bottom, with one level, one aspect of his life, but not all but but it's also like it's your rock bottom is again what you can imagine, right, like, and like where you are at in life, like like for somebody, hitting rock bottom might be like losing all their money or losing their company. For somebody else it might be like I don't know, like losing their friends or losing their family, or like you know some something else, and those are all outlined by different people in different ways. There's no, just maybe predefined rock bottom. Someone might say, yeah, complete rock bottom is just being dead and that's it, because then you no longer have life and you no longer have the opportunity to do anything. Some people might say that something else is worse than death. That death would actually be better than X. So different people will have that defined in different ways.

Harris: 52:49

So you think I have another rock bottom coming.

John: 52:52

I'm going to make it.

Mike: 52:55

You're going to help them get there faster, right?

Toliy: 52:56

yes, I, I, I don't know yet. Like I said, I don't know yet. You could, you could not with your green hair. The more, the more you learn, the more of like, the realization, like in order to realize shit is actually fucked up and you to actually feel that you need need to educate yourself, the more understanding of how shitty things are you'll actually feel and then, I think, you getting a clearer picture then of what's going on. I think that you'll probably start to feel an immense amount of pain.

Toliy: 53:28

But, if you don't educate yourself and you don't do those things, then I don't think that those rock bottoms will happen and you don't do those things, then I don't think that those rock bottoms will happen, Because these bad periods or rock bottoms or just like you know down things, they'll happen, but again, it'll just be based on where you're at at that time.

Harris: 53:48

Is this what you've been trying to reroute my brain to level up?

Toliy: 53:53

Well, I mean, we're trying to make an attempt to educate you, but you're very difficult to teach, but so is everybody else.

Mike: 54:01

So how does someone right, like what you're saying, okay, if it's not rock bottom. How does someone what you're saying sounds to me at least like how does someone change their life if, the way I see it, right, just generally, uh, people are like they're not happy with a lot of things and a lot of times they blame it on external things. How does something change that? Where people actually now shift and they, like you saying, open to learn, open to discovering these things that you're talking about, these concepts, what causes the person to all of a sudden think, when they're always in this position as the victim, because I feel like a lot of people play that role- Like oh it's just happening to me, Like it's fucked up, Like it's not my fault.

Toliy: 54:47

Yeah, but I don't think it's an all of a sudden thing, because I think that there's a lot of things that have to happen in order for you to feel this way. But yeah, I mean, like I think it's a long, grueling process and I think it's very difficult for these kind of changes to happen. But there's a lot of things that spark and there's okay, there's pain no pain, no gain.

Toliy: 55:21

But everybody experiences pain, right well, we all experience pain and we don't change things right well, yeah, but then it's like everyone has different pain uh tolerances. So you might be experiencing something it's painful for for you, but it's not at a point where it's either not like if, if you're experiencing something, something it's painful and it's not significant enough for you to do something about it and you acknowledge it, then like and and and like. For example, if your teacher is pain which I mean if that's happening, it probably is right Then it's not that painful. But if you have the ability to understand what's happening, acknowledge what's happening and not need it to get to a point where it's extremely painful to get you to do something, then that's probably what I would call like a high level of wisdom.

Mike: 56:16

Yeah, but again you're describing something very complicated and advanced.

Toliy: 56:20

Well, all of these things are very complicated and advanced, but you don't jump from being ignorant about so many things. Well, no that's exactly why you use pain. Pain doesn't require education.

Mike: 56:34

Right, but is there a point where the pain that's why I I keep using this like understanding a concept of rock bottom, because there comes a point where you've endured enough pain and you can you finally say like yo, I cannot keep doing things this way, and I think that's the rock bottom when you finally fire yourself, you finally humble yourself and you're open to learn. I just don't understand, like, what needs to happen for people who just live their lives, keep making mistakes, suffering and all of a sudden yeah, I get, it's not all of a sudden, it's many years but why did that specific incident have you now do?

Toliy: 57:09

a turn. There's no such thing as that.

Mike: 57:11

There's no one incident it wasn't one incident, but it was one point in time that you actually did shift. It took many things to get there, yeah, but why was that one incident, the one that you did it?

Toliy: 57:20

yes, yeah, I don't think it's because of that one incident. I think it's in a accumulation 100.

Mike: 57:26

I agree it's accumulation, but why, at that point in time, did you make the change?

Toliy: 57:31

well, because, well, because it was then too much, like, the accumulation of what's going on becomes too much, and one of those things come into play, like pain, or fear, or depression. Right, these things like push you out to do something, and that's why, again, pain is an everlasting teacher that doesn't really have, like you don't have to have a choice or you don't have to do anything to experience it. It's going to happen regardless, which is why the majority of the world learns through pain, or discipline, or fear, because, because they're very like a authoritative, like forms, so, um, once the pain threshold has been crossed, which happens, I think, through an accumulation, you could implement potential change, and that change again happens from fear, in that case, or or or pain, for example. So I I don't think again that it's still like a moment that like creates a fundamental shift, or like, um, where a person's like now humble, now this, no, I think that they're either scared or they're in too much pain, and it's a very forceful scenario.

Mike: 58:59

Okay, all right.

Toliy: 59:05

I think the more complicated one, the more difficult one for most people is to be able to understand what's happening and be able to take your own control of things, and for you to basically do what you want to do in life based on what you see and what you understand, and you actually have control over that. And that's what I think where you use wisdom as your tool, versus like, pain is like something that you're um, like most people are like just automatically subscribed to like, no matter how many times you opt out, you're forever subscribed to pain, but it doesn't need to be the teacher. It doesn't need to be, but it will be if you don't do something about it, and that's guaranteed no, I, I agree, I agree with that, but I think, yeah, I guess you have.

Mike: 1:00:01

You sounds to me like you have a problem with this, uh, rock bottom thing. You don't like that, the emphasis that's being placed on it yeah, I want to read some stuff that elder said.

Toliy: 1:00:13

He said rock bottoms are closely tied um to our attachments. Right, which makes sense like whatever is important to you, whatever you value, wherever that you're at, those rock bottoms will be um associated there, right? Yeah, he said one way is to exhaust the attachments um jim carrey's approach, to realize that your desire is in shit, that they won't satisfy you. The threshold is reached.

Mike: 1:00:40

That's why the last action spilled over and you so-called reached the rock bottom yeah, no, I understand that it's going to take a lot to get there and and I think there's my understanding is that there's rock bottoms and different things right, you may have a like, a attachment to a job and to making a living, a certain financial lifestyle, and until you realize that, like jim carrey thing, you, you're gonna suffer with that, you're gonna have the pain, um, if you reach it or you don't, whatever. But then there's other things right. Then there's other like, uh, you may you have other levels of like, uh, attachment right in different fields. So I think you may solve one piece of the puzzle, but there's so many other pieces of the puzzle to solve. So you may have, you may have excelled right, for example, about your relationship with money and your attachment to money, but maybe you haven't resolved your attachment and with relationships or health or I don't know.

Toliy: 1:01:41

There's a bunch of not it like to the person who's not thinking about that or even know that, like this kind of stuff is important or or even exist, like that's not even in their rock bottom cards yet right, but I think that once they level up, those rock bottoms will happen as they like, continue to level, to level up and no longer okay, like the worry about like, for example, like shelter, or like basic needs, like, for example, like that no longer becomes like a um, like like the uh, the rock bottom thing is.

Toliy: 1:02:11

Like like maslowlow's hierarchy of needs, right, like, as you continue to go up the pyramid there, or like whatever it is right, um, your rock bottoms change and it's no longer like, if you're, for example, in the level of like actualization, and this is where you're at, your rock bottom is no longer like having no money, or like basic shell shelter, um, unless something like a changes, right, but like that's not where you're at anymore.

Toliy: 1:02:41

Same same thing on the opposite scale, right, if you're all the way at the bottom and this is where you're at and your rock bottoms are there, then you're not even thinking, or like you don't even understand what good relationships are, like, what's actually important, what's not. Um, which I think is also why, again, like elder brought in the example of jim carrey. Right, like, because he knows that the majority of the world's like thesis of life is to get rich. Right, like harris's is right and he welcomes all. Like he, he, he hopes for everybody to experience that, because he for himself has realized that this is not it. But there's no way for just that message to just be like okay, like one person got it. Now everybody like can get it. Everyone needs to go through that kind of process to make this realization. Some will, some won't.

Harris: 1:03:33

Have you ever gone through that realization?

Toliy: 1:03:40

What the rich realization?

Mike: 1:03:41

that money's not everything, yeah, of course yeah, you're not buying it, harris, no, all right, tell us, tell us, why you feel that way explain, tell them life is easier with money.

Harris: 1:03:53

No worries, I told you this. Not having to worry about paying the bills, Not having to worry about mortgages rent Okay. Without money you can't do shit in this world, Jack shit. Right, everything requires money.

Toliy: 1:04:14

I think it depends, right. So, first, first off, if you're in a position, like you are probably probably right, where you're not able to keep to to, uh, to provide yourself currently with your like, what you call like your needs, then, yes, the most important thing for that individual is money, right? But I think that, um, if you get to a point where those things are provided and you're no longer worried so much about them, um, the scale of importance on those things go up, because you're gonna have other things that you're gonna, um, like other issues that will happen in your head that you won't be able to solve with money, right and it makes everything okay, man well, again, that's for you to find out, that's not for me to tell you like one way or another.

Mike: 1:05:04

I don't think John is buying it.

Harris: 1:05:06

John, what's your opinion on this man? What do you think, john? I think you're full of shit. You don't think money.

Mike: 1:05:12

You don't agree with me money face the mic, guys, so we can hear you you don't agree with me Money.

Harris: 1:05:16

Face the mic, guys, so we can hear you. You don't agree with me? Money makes everything.

John: 1:05:18

Sometimes Easier Sometimes.

Harris: 1:05:22

You got your money bro.

John: 1:05:24

You dig, it is.

Harris: 1:05:25

Yeah, you can't do shit in this world without the money, man.

Mike: 1:05:30

How much do you? Need to do shit, you need a decent living right, you have to put a number on it. In Nebraska you can buy a house for $25,000. That's right, $25,000. In New. York, you can't even buy a pair of underwear for $25,000.

John: 1:05:43

Give us your four pin numbers right now.

Toliy: 1:05:49

How much money has this stuff gone A year? What?

Harris: 1:05:53

How much money do I need to make a year to be?

Toliy: 1:05:54

comfortable, whatever.

Harris: 1:05:55

I need to be able to pay rent and have money left over to have a bit of fun. Do you pay rent?

Mike: 1:06:05

He's a deadbeat and he has a wife and two kids.

Harris: 1:06:07

No, fuck you, you. No, I don't.

Mike: 1:06:09

I live with my dad.

Toliy: 1:06:11

And a boyfriend.

Harris: 1:06:13

I need to be able to move out, be able to support myself.

Mike: 1:06:16

Give us a number, since you're a mathematician.

Toliy: 1:06:18

Yeah, what are we talking about?

Harris: 1:06:20

Let's say Starting out.

Toliy: 1:06:24

I'm just asking what do you need?

Mike: 1:06:25

for this. Just give us a number, save some numbers To not have any worries.

Harris: 1:06:28

Yeah, stop. What do you need for?

John: 1:06:29

this. Just give us a number, save some numbers To not have any worries. Yeah, stop it voting.

Harris: 1:06:31

In my opinion, things will get easier once you reach near the six-figure mark.

Toliy: 1:06:39

Near yeah, okay, so like $80,000, $90,000 a year, yeah, that makes a little thing easier.

Harris: 1:06:47

And then when you reach the six-figure mark.

Toliy: 1:06:49

You ain't got no worries left, man, okay. So all you need to reach is six figures, and that's it. You think that you're going to be happy.

Harris: 1:06:54

You're good after that? Yeah, you know $100,000, $150,000 a year. You know everything's peachy. $200,000 a year, that's even better. Keep going up and up and up. Right, are you happy totally?

Toliy: 1:07:07

he looks upset well, well, I mean, I'm having a hard time understanding what you're saying money makes everything go easier, right once you, if you reach the, the six-figure mark well, like it'll make some some things easier, like you don't have to worry about your next meal, exactly right, for example. But you can live well. Sure, yeah, but you can live Well. Sure, yeah, but you can also go and go to Kadampa in upstate New York, which is a Buddhist monastery.

Harris: 1:07:34

Why the fuck am I going to Kadampa? Well, you can.

Toliy: 1:07:38

As long as you, for example, work every day, you have a place to stay and your meals are covered. So like you don't have to worry about rent or food, so like you have some needs met.

Harris: 1:07:49

Why the hell would I want to go to a good Tampa? It's an example.

Toliy: 1:07:52

Yeah, then you don't have to worry about rent or or food.

Harris: 1:07:57

That's not what I'm trying to do here. Okay, I'm not trying to become a monk. Well what are you trying to become? I'm trying to have you become a rock star. I'm trying to be Enjoy life man, yeah, but don't enjoy life, man?

Toliy: 1:08:09

Yeah, but what does that mean enjoy?

Harris: 1:08:11

life. Do shit right, like what Right now. Right, irish girls, that's one bro. You remember how much that shit cost us boy. I had a credit card bill of a thousand dollars at the end of that trip and I'm still paying that shit off. Okay, you are, yeah Damn, I still got like $300 on that shit, okay. But I'm talking about being able to go on vacation, enjoy a little bit, settle down, not have to worry about anything.

Toliy: 1:08:45

No worries, no, yeah, but can you go on vacation if you have anxiety? Can you go on vacation if you have poor relationships with your family and friends? Can you go on vacation if you're a piece of shit? Oh, fuck you man. Like, how will you feel on vacation? Do you think that you'll be able to enjoy vacation?

Toliy: 1:09:05

Like you have the money With the six figures. Yeah, let's say you're like a Wolf of Wall Street guy. Right, like you make good money, you make a couple mil, but you're a piece of shit to like your family. You're a piece of shit to your friends. You need to do a lot of like stimulants to get through the day, so you're all whacked out.

Harris: 1:09:28

I'm just giving you an example. Right like you have money but stimulants to get through the day.

Toliy: 1:09:29

So you're all whacked out. Where the hell did this come from? I'm just giving you an example. You have money, but are you happy? Can you be happy? You could not worry about your next meal, or you can have some things, but you're not going to be able to enjoy those things.

Harris: 1:09:45

Where did this come from, man?

John: 1:09:46

It's just an example.

Harris: 1:09:48

Are you trying to say this is what I'm acting like right now? Yes, you are.

Toliy: 1:09:53

You don't have the ability to make a lot of money right now.

John: 1:09:55

Yes.

Harris: 1:09:59

Let's use you for an example. Are you happy?

Toliy: 1:10:02

I'm trying to depict you an example Changing the subject. I'm trying to depict you an example of somebody with money Right.

Harris: 1:10:10

You're talking about someone with millions right now.

Toliy: 1:10:12

Whatever, however much, if you don't have health, if you don't have good relationships with your family or with your friends or the people around you, if you're not able to help others around you, if you're not able to influence your own life and other lives around you, what good is that money going to do?

Harris: 1:10:31

Yeah, that sucks, but when someone gets that money, it's up to them what the hell they do with it, how they treat people around them.

Toliy: 1:10:37

But before they get the money, they have to understand these concepts and they have to value them right. The worst thing, the worst thing that can happen to you, is you get money before you get these things.

Harris: 1:10:52

I already proved. I don't change man.

Mike: 1:10:56

You were a millionaire before.

John: 1:10:57

No, I'm the same person Give me the money. Put the money in the bag.

Harris: 1:11:03

Money ain't going to change who I am.

Mike: 1:11:05

Is that a good person or a bad person? A happy person A sad person.

Toliy: 1:11:08

How would money not change who you are? I wouldn't change who I am.

John: 1:11:09

Is that a good person or a bad person? A happy person, a sad person? How would that change who you are?

Toliy: 1:11:11

evil person wouldn't change who I am I don't forget my roots. I don't forget that's not what I'm talking about you can throw money at at people who other people who are stupid. It's not gonna help them.

Harris: 1:11:20

You might give them something that's for you right there, okay, thank you fuck you go fuck yourself, yeah right back yeah yeah, like I'm.

Toliy: 1:11:30

I'm not talking about you forgetting about others or stuff like that. I'm talking about, like, if you're a piece of shit and you find are you claiming I'm a piece of shit right now probably yeah, um, if you're a piece of shit and you find a way to do a task in the in, in in america or or wherever, where you can get highly compensated for it and you can make a lot of money.

Toliy: 1:11:55

But you're a piece of shit. Your life is not going to be good, and if you think it will, then you can try that. See if you can even get to a point where you can make a lot of money, right.

Harris: 1:12:09

How did this go from being a piece of shit to money makes everything easier.

Mike: 1:12:14

Well, I think money is a huge attachment, and I think attachments are a huge part of suffering.

Harris: 1:12:19

I think everyone can agree that money does make everything easier.

Mike: 1:12:24

No, I don't think everybody can agree.

Toliy: 1:12:25

Yeah, I mean that word.

Harris: 1:12:26

Everything doesn't make everything easier. You can't live without easier.

John: 1:12:29

Like some.

Harris: 1:12:29

You can't live without it, dude.

Toliy: 1:12:31

It does make some things easier, better, right, but, like I said, you can't have the money.

Toliy: 1:12:38

Without having the right head on your shoulders, without being the right person, like being humble, you'll never be able to enjoy the money.

Toliy: 1:12:46

Like right now, for example, if you and harris have no money right and you desire a lot of money, right, right, you desire that because you, you would both have like this dream or this outline of what will happen if you get it right, like like if I just dropped you both like 100 mil, right, you have a lot of money and if and if you think that's going to make you happy and your life's going to be amazing, it's because you, because we didn't have the money. Well, yeah, you didn't have the money, but you're thinking, you're like um, using your mind to like think about how amazing life is going to be, right, um, but that may not, that may not necessarily be true. Like you're assuming of what will actually happen, but you don't know for sure because neither of you have ever had a hundred mil right. So I think, in general, a lot of people have this crazy pursuit of money or this like it's the most important thing ever to get rich.

Toliy: 1:13:49

They're always thinking about that they're always thinking about like this scenario and they're so certain that like, okay, if they were to get this, it's going to make them happy. But how can you be certain? For example, if you've never had that kind of money, if you've never been rich, how do you know that you will actually feel, feel happy, like you may be able to go on vacations, you may be able to have like a big house, like nice cars, but how do you actually know that you'll be happy?

John: 1:14:13

you just, you can't know for sure, you just don't know you don't.

Toliy: 1:14:16

But people act like they definitely do. Right, right can you.

Mike: 1:14:19

Maybe we can use an example of in times, maybe you could think back. You could think back when you wanted something very badly right. You had, like yo, I really want this bicycle. Or like I don't know, this girl or my entire childhood. Yeah, I don't want to hear about that.

Harris: 1:14:34

Gay stuff Fuck you Fuck, you Go fuck yourself.

John: 1:14:39

I just wanted a boyfriend.

Harris: 1:14:40

Fuck you dude.

John: 1:14:41

You wanted a boyfriend, was there ever?

Mike: 1:14:43

a situation in your life that you really wanted something and when you got that thing you're like you're actually the shit is pretty whack. It's not the excitement before the thing is actually bigger than the thing, like when you experience that, yeah, like wait when, when you were a kid, you experienced that every day. How about that? I'll give you an example right now like I just want to dildo I don't know, I wanted to ask

Toliy: 1:15:07

me a question when you were a kid for example, when you were like 11 or 12 or something, 13. At that point you had a different outline. If I had this, if I had the sickest gaming PC, I would be so happy if I had the Playstation, like this or these games. Or someone gave me five thousand dollars because everybody had it. No, well or no.

Toliy: 1:15:33

No, I'm saying no like when you were a kid right there there was something a lot smaller like that you view now. Like now maybe you want to be a millionaire or like crazy rich, right, but when you were like, let's say like eight or nine, right, just go there.

Toliy: 1:15:46

It's not like, at point, your goal is to get crazy rich, like like you want, just like a nice gaming system, right, like I don't know, you want to make the basketball team Like you. You, you want things that are like an adult right now can relatively afford really easily. All right, right. Right, you can get that gaming PC now you could play as much video games, I guess, as you want now, like there's no restrictions, right, but at one point, like that's what you were convinced of, that would make you happy. And when you were to, and and when you were to get that, what would you want next? Something else, right, there would be another thing that's probably a bit bigger that you would want, and it'll be the same thing will happen, for example, with money, maybe.

Toliy: 1:16:26

Maybe Harris is talking about, like he's talking about 80, 90 K right In the East coast here. That is nothing that is considered poor, right, you are poor If you have to live on your own and you make 80 or 90 a year, right After taxes. You're probably talking about, like you know, 50 K, having 50 K, most like one or two bedroom apartments now are $2,000 a month plus, right.

John: 1:16:53

On the East.

Toliy: 1:16:54

Coast, right that. And then food and then phone TV, this and that, internet, car insurance yeah, car insurance, like you're broke, right. So what he's talking about is like that will be good. I agree that that would be good, based on where he's at now. But once he gets that, it's not going to be no, 100 K, it's going to be 500 K, it's going to be 300 K, it's going to be a million dollars. And then once he gets to a million dollars a year and he has like a little boat and like a five bedroom house, but no summer summer house and he doesn't have jet skis and he doesn't have like this and that. Now he's going to want to be. He's going to want a yacht, right, he's also going to want to fly private, but he can't. And it keeps going. Once you get to 10 million, now what? Now you want something else. Now you, you don't want to pay for an agency to fly private. You don't want to pay for an agency to fly private. You want to have your own plane.

Toliy: 1:17:49

You want to have it available for you 24-7, wherever you're at you want to have a house in every different place that you own and you want to have a butler there, a chef and everything. God damn right. This keeps on going. And then it shows you that you'll never be happy like. You'll always just want more things. And that's not even talking about the mental struggles that you will have along the way with all your different parts of your life. That's just being the person who's like, assuming everything is great and all you need is money Because you have the money.

Tommy: 1:18:20

It's an endless pit.

Toliy: 1:18:21

That person who makes 10 mil a year. There was a point in their lives where all they wanted for them to have everything would be an Xbox and be able to play it as much as you want.

Harris: 1:18:31

Look at Bezos he's living the best fucking time of his fucking life we have no idea what you're talking about.

Mike: 1:18:35

Can you please shut the fuck up?

John: 1:18:36

Thanks, how can you say that? Take off his microphone right now.

Mike: 1:18:40

Yeah, you're next. You're about to get Tommy'd. Fuck you. You have no idea what life that guy's living, so you definitely can't speak on it.

Harris: 1:18:47

He's living a great life. He's on his yacht every other fucking year.

John: 1:18:50

Harris is just bald. Harris.

Mike: 1:18:54

You have no idea what kind of life he's living, just besides what you've seen on TV. He's got his wife.

Harris: 1:18:59

He got divorced. He's got a hundred billion dollars, okay.

Toliy: 1:19:04

Yeah, you operate in a world where you think money will make you happy. I think if you put yourself in a position to continuously acquire money, I think eventually you'll disagree or you'll die before realizing that it depends how dumb you are.

John: 1:19:20

It's probably the second one.

Harris: 1:19:22

Gotta get that money. Gotta get that money, gotta get that money.

Mike: 1:19:30

John. What do you think, John? I think? Is it the money or is Harris an idiot? Is this the second one? Oh, we know Harris is an idiot, but Do you think Harris is right about what he's saying About the money? That has huge attachment to it?

John: 1:19:41

No, he's all wrong.

Harris: 1:19:44

Yo, you're not even making six figures.

John: 1:19:46

so Harris, you're not making any money, you're just a temp. You're just a janitor.

Harris: 1:19:50

I'm being paid John's the janitor. He blends in with the janitor.

John: 1:19:53

Harris is just a fire hydrant.

Mike: 1:19:55

The thing, is when you, what did he say?

Toliy: 1:19:59

Harris is just a fire hydrant.

Mike: 1:20:02

The thing is, with those things, with things, you're just a border wall. With items. You're never going to reach a point where they're going to provide you what you actually want. You'll always keep wanting the next big thing. It never ends. There's nothing wrong with that.

Harris: 1:20:18

Oh, if you're an idiot, no there's nothing wrong with it, because if you can keep getting those things, it just means you're very, very successful In what In making money In business, so you'd rather have money but be unhappy for the rest of your life. It doesn't have to be unhappy. You find a nice lady, you settle down, that's it.

John: 1:20:33

How was your last relationship? He likes guys.

Harris: 1:20:36

John, would you shut the?

John: 1:20:38

hell up.

Mike: 1:20:40

Sure, if you want, we'll pay for the operation and get you trans, fuck you dude, I already paid for it.

Toliy: 1:20:47

Fuck you. How was your last? He's been saving up for this.

Mike: 1:20:51

Fuck you. How was your last relationship, harris? Fuck you, say it, say it, go ahead. What do you mean? How was your last relationship?

John: 1:21:02

Was I right.

Mike: 1:21:03

With your mom. Oh shit, come on, stop lying now, just because you're on air Don't be a liar. What are you talking about? You know what I'm talking about With your mom.

Harris: 1:21:09

With your last girlfriend. What me giving her money right now?

Mike: 1:21:12

oh, not that, but everything about it. You had a bad relationship.

Harris: 1:21:14

No, it wasn't that bad. I mean sure we got into arguments we couldn't really you know and you do.

Mike: 1:21:20

You think that if you had money you guys wouldn't get into those arguments it wasn't really about the money, no, okay but you said you love, said you love her. You never felt like this way about her. And if you had the money, it still wouldn't help. So what are you going to do? Are you going to buy her?

Harris: 1:21:37

No, what the hell wrong with you? So what are you going to do If money solves most problems.

Mike: 1:21:41

I think you said maybe most or all. What are you going to do If things don't work out, you move on, man. But you said this is the love of your life. You never felt like this about somebody.

Harris: 1:21:51

We're going to see if we can work things out. If not, it's time to move the fuck on and find a new lady, that's it.

Toliy: 1:21:58

I've realized over the last few weeks that in this kind of situation Harris is a little bit smarter than what he's saying. I think he's just pretending.

John: 1:22:09

Pretending to be an idiot. Yeah, right now I think he's a real idiot.

Harris: 1:22:13

You shouldn't be talking. You're a real idiot too.

John: 1:22:15

Real life.

Mike: 1:22:17

I know you are, but what am I?

Harris: 1:22:19

Yo you're a real idiot too. You gotta admit that we both are.

Mike: 1:22:24

So far I haven't heard anything from John, so maybe John will share some of his stupid experiences.

Harris: 1:22:28

Share some of his stupid experiences. That Share some of your stupid experiences.

Mike: 1:22:31

That he's made a mistake, besides getting to know you, it started 20 years. I was about to say.

John: 1:22:36

It was a dark, dark day. It was raining that day.

Harris: 1:22:40

John started touching me.

John: 1:22:42

And then Harris took me to the boys' bathroom and I'm like stop.

Harris: 1:22:49

John is very inappropriate. He tried putting something in my drink, man.

Mike: 1:22:53

He tried to roof you in third grade.

John: 1:22:54

Yeah, no first grade First grade okay, Harris tried to test me.

Harris: 1:22:57

He put something in my juice box.

Mike: 1:22:59

Harris tried to test me in my no-no place, so, john, do you think that money is going to solve all your problems?

Mike: 1:23:05

Not all, but some it's like what he said about the meals and all that stuff so there's like this totally was referencing maslow's hierarchy pyramid of uh needs something like that, but it's like food, shelter, right, right. Those are the necessities. If you don't have what you need, yeah, just you need to survive right like before. You can then go and explore like uh, higher levels of life and happier moments what do you mean?

John: 1:23:33

like vacation, like that, yeah, like here I I I'll tell you what it says here.

Toliy: 1:23:38

Like okay, matt's heart, I'm. Hierarchy of needs. It says, uh, physiological needs, this is the very bottom of the barrel. Okay, okay, breathing, food, water, shelter, clothing, sleep Right, that's what we need.

John: 1:23:52

Without those things until you achieve that level, you can't progress and live a better quality of life.

Mike: 1:23:57

This pyramid is a quality of life pyramid.

Toliy: 1:23:59

Okay, Second step, level two Health, employment, property, family, social ability.

Mike: 1:24:10

Step two. John, do you have your health? I mean Harry's Do you have your health? No, I don't have my health. No, you don't have your health.

John: 1:24:15

No, he has no lungs.

Mike: 1:24:17

Do you have financial stability? Of course he does. No, you have property.

Harris: 1:24:22

Then why is that the fucking second step, dude?

Toliy: 1:24:24

Because the next ones are significantly harder. What's the third one?

Harris: 1:24:27

The second step should be the first step, dude.

Toliy: 1:24:30

Third step, once you have these two, step number three is love and belonging, which is friendship, family intimacy, sense of connection, being very in tune with these things and having a real strong development. Then there's step four self-esteem, okay, which is confidence, achievement, respect of others, the need to be a unique individual, um. And then the the highest step is a self-actualization, which is a morality, creativity, um, spontaneous spontaneity, yeah, acceptance, um experience, purpose, meaning and inner potential of life. So it's like you're not gonna again tom, talking about creativity, you're not gonna be on the self-actualization step without being able to have food and water. So, yes, money can be thrown at some of these things, but it gets to a certain point where you're not going to improve friendship with money. Have real friendships.

Toliy: 1:25:42

I'm not talking about just being a baller and being like yo, john, we're friends, I'm going to pay for your whole trip to Mexico. That's all fake. That's going to be fake, right, because I'm just in it for the money. Again, family intimacy, sense of connection. You could have money, you could get a wife Because you might be a baller and attract a particular type of girl, but it doesn't mean that you're going to have love, right? She might love, right, yeah. Well, yeah, she might be able to still get married, right, right, yeah, and she'll cheat on you all the time and spend all your money and yeah, you'll be miserable, she'll throw the hot dog down the hallway.

John: 1:26:15

For for you, don't say. Don't say hot dog, because iris gets excited.

Toliy: 1:26:17

Oh don't worry. Oh, that's enough, baby. Self-esteem.

Harris: 1:26:20

How much money can buy self-esteem if I made millions, I'd give john some. What the hell are you talking about? You go to what if I? If I made millions, I'd give John some money. John don't take it.

John: 1:26:29

It's a trap. It's like Monopoly money.

Harris: 1:26:34

I'll remember that.

Mike: 1:26:38

Probably not, but yeah, you already forgot it.

Harris: 1:26:40

Payback's a bitch.

Toliy: 1:26:42

Yeah Right, it can't buy self-esteem, it can't buy confidence. It's all fake shit.

Mike: 1:26:51

Would you prefer to have fake friends, harrison, that you could buy them with money, or no?

Harris: 1:26:57

I already have an OG friend. That's all I fucking need, bro. Who's your OG?

Mike: 1:27:01

friend JC, but why would he stay friends with you if you become a rich guy? Rich prick.

Harris: 1:27:06

I wouldn't be a rich prick. I'd be sharing the wealth. You're already a poor prick.

Mike: 1:27:10

I'd already be sharing the wealth.

John: 1:27:12

Can I rob you?

Harris: 1:27:14

You shot in the goddamn head boy. Excellent, you got any goddamn mind, oh my God.

John: 1:27:20

That's right.

Harris: 1:27:22

Goddamn allergies, dude.

John: 1:27:24

You don't have allergies.

Harris: 1:27:25

Stop lying.

John: 1:27:26

He's allergic to girls.

Mike: 1:27:27

You couldn't buy money. You couldn't throw money at allergies, right Sure, you can Buy some.

Harris: 1:27:31

Claritin bitch.

Mike: 1:27:33

You want me to buy you Claritin. I can get some Claritin. Fine.

Harris: 1:27:37

So get it. You can throw money at allergies. Call Claritin Eye drops. It doesn't work always. That's why I got prescription at the house boy.

Mike: 1:27:49

So, Harris, what are you saying, John? Anything you want to say to your friend here who is clearly delusional? Money, money, money.

John: 1:27:55

Harris, I'm going to rob you after this podcast. Okay, good luck with that boy. I'm going to rob you $2.

Harris: 1:28:05

I got more than $2.

John: 1:28:07

All right, fine, $3. Do you think he's? Do you think?

Mike: 1:28:10

he's. What do you think he's About his whole money thing? Is it going to solve all his problems? No, why is he so convinced about it, though?

John: 1:28:20

Because he just watches too much TV.

Mike: 1:28:22

You're saying, his mind is like Play-Doh it's very easy to maneuver he doesn't have a mind.

John: 1:28:27

There's nothing in there. I checked.

Harris: 1:28:31

At least I don't sit on air conditioner all day, air conditioners, all day playing with my wiener.

John: 1:28:36

At least I'm not going to have green hair.

Mike: 1:28:42

I think people are starting to wonder about it. I think people want to know about the green hair.

Toliy: 1:28:47

Wait, who wouldn't want to sit on the air conditioner all day and play with their wiener?

Mike: 1:28:50

That sounds fine. What is wrong with you and get paid for it. I think that's a dream.

John: 1:28:54

That's a dream Dude, I'm on it.

Toliy: 1:28:56

It sounds like John has the best job.

Harris: 1:28:58

You want to sit on the rooftop showing people your wiener? What?

John: 1:29:01

stop pretending like you don't know he does OnlyFans from the ACU with the pants.

Harris: 1:29:11

So I'm sure people are wondering what this green hair is. I'm sure they are. I lost a bet that I could fast for three days and I had to dye my hair green and eyebrows green for two weeks did you tell John what happened that day or no? I did. He was upset because he had faith in me.

Toliy: 1:29:33

No, but do you know what he did, or no? He drank the coffee with sugar, right?

Harris: 1:29:36

No, I drank the coffee with sugar and I ate a 15 inch sub, but he owes you money right. I gave him the money.

Toliy: 1:29:43

He gave me 60 bucks. Okay, he was supposed to fast Monday, tuesday, wednesday and eat again on Thursday. Right, right and what's it called? On Monday during lunchtime he couldn't even make it to lunch on Monday he couldn't make it to 11am.

Harris: 1:30:02

He was already starving, he's like good man. I didn't make it past 11.

Toliy: 1:30:05

He gave up the first half of the first day, which would have been just not eating lunch. He couldn't even make it that far and he went straight into Jersey Mike's and ate a 15-inch Italian sub sandwich which is meant for two to three people. This guy can't help himself with 15-inch.

John: 1:30:24

Fuck you. All right, let me tell you this, all right.

Mike: 1:30:28

Hold on. What was his punishment? I think the green hair was just like we let you out of the bed, a negotiation.

Harris: 1:30:36

I'm not saying what it is.

Mike: 1:30:37

If he lost the bet, he was supposed to wear a dress for a week to work. He already does that anyway, probably Screw you dude and instead he lost the bet and we gave him a negotiation that he has to paint his eyebrows and his hair lime green, I want to point out that Eldar helped me with this negotiation. It was supposed to be a month, but Eldar helped you and he got you at two weeks.

John: 1:30:59

Fuck that, put a month.

Harris: 1:31:01

I would love to put a month I'll slap you across the face. So, Harris would $100 million.

Mike: 1:31:07

Help you out with that bet and keeping your word With your green hair Would you become a man of your word. If you had that money, oh shit. Or you would just try to throw money at me.

Harris: 1:31:17

Like a.

Mike: 1:31:17

Totally.

Harris: 1:31:18

I don't think that kind of money. I think it needs to be like $100 million to make you guys change your mind.

John: 1:31:23

No, it's too late. You're doing it Friday, right? Yeah, it's too late. You're doing it Friday right?

Mike: 1:31:29

yeah, no, he's doing it like early next week when Elder's back when does Elder come back?

Harris: 1:31:32

no, uh, john wants to be there, so it's gonna be Friday absolutely.

John: 1:31:35

I think it's a Friday right yeah, it's gonna be Friday cause you wanna be there.

Mike: 1:31:38

We're gonna decide when it's gonna be not you alright calm down anytime, so be prepared. I think John will make it if he wants to.

John: 1:31:46

Oh, I'll make it.

Mike: 1:31:51

Chee-wee-wee.

John: 1:31:52

Chee-wee-wee. So it wasn't the coffee, it was the Jersey Mike's.

Harris: 1:32:00

I had some coffee once. I said it was over, but they kept pushing me like, yeah, you can break it, whatever you want, go ahead.

Mike: 1:32:03

Exactly. You don't have any self control or integrity. And why? Do you keep hitting that vape, eldar, let me do it. You asked me, I told you no.

Harris: 1:32:15

I'm not older, so first of all, right, yeah, okay. It's like you were totally like yeah, come to lunch, you don't got to eat nothing, you can smell it.

Mike: 1:32:25

Nobody told you that.

John: 1:32:26

Why did you just stay? You totally did man.

Harris: 1:32:28

I didn't tell you that Huh.

John: 1:32:30

Why didn't you just stay?

Mike: 1:32:31

I was fucking starving, and the problem is I take meds that make me hungry, so when I'm doing work I can't really concentrate, so maybe it's better to not run your mouth and make promises you can't keep for even 10% of the time.

Harris: 1:32:43

You're a bitch Boom.

John: 1:32:45

That's not what your mama said last night she said exactly the same thing and I agreed. Me and Cheryl. Stop changing the subject.

Mike: 1:32:54

Penny loves you.

Harris: 1:32:55

You gotta relax, man no biting.

John: 1:32:57

Stop trying to kiss the dog why are you putting your tongue out like that though?

Harris: 1:33:03

No biting Good girl. No biting.

Mike: 1:33:08

So did you know this for a long time that he's a failure. That he's a bullshitter from New Jersey? Oh, did you know his nickname? That he's a bull from New Jersey? That's fake news. And did you know that he actually is a bullshitter from?

John: 1:33:20

New Jersey, oh for sure, man for 20 years man.

Mike: 1:33:24

So this is not the first time he's been. When I first met him.

John: 1:33:29

He told me his name was John and he lied.

Harris: 1:33:32

First grade dude. What's your name? John Yo, shut up.

John: 1:33:37

Put it back on man.

Mike: 1:33:39

Stop yelling like an infant.

Harris: 1:33:40

What's your name? What are you doing? What's your name, john? What do you tell people your name is?

John: 1:33:50

I tell them your name is harris I tell them I'm the real slim shady oh, shut up.

Harris: 1:33:57

When we, when you come to a party like the fourth of july, you kept saying oh, my name's harris. Why you want to be harris.

Mike: 1:34:03

So bad man I think he was making a joke.

John: 1:34:05

I don't know if you can harris is chill, it's just a joke. Do you understand jokes or no?

Harris: 1:34:09

that's not what your mama said.

Mike: 1:34:11

No, she saw your wiener. I think she said that making a joke.

Harris: 1:34:13

I don't know if you can.

John: 1:34:14

Do you understand jokes or no? That's not what your mama said. She saw your wiener.

Mike: 1:34:16

I think she said it was a joke. Is that a joke? What's?

Harris: 1:34:17

that one inch over there you have a one inch your chode.

John: 1:34:21

Nah, that's why John can only go to the parlors, the parlors, yeah you know what I'm talking about. Can you explain the massage parlor? I don't know what this man is talking about. Explain a little more.

Mike: 1:34:35

Harris, they use a magnifying glass when they service you.

Harris: 1:34:38

Fuck you, I'm not the one that has to go to the massage parlor.

John: 1:34:42

They go, they see the two holes.

Harris: 1:34:44

Oh, fuck you.

Mike: 1:34:46

So, harris, obviously you're wrong about the money thing. I'm right about that but I think time, maybe this life or the next one you're gonna find out, or maybe a couple more than that depends how long, what's your pain tolerance and your thresholds for what are you doing, man?

Harris: 1:35:08

why are you taking pictures like a weirdo over there? You see, this guy, I see him yeah.

John: 1:35:13

They can't see me.

Mike: 1:35:15

They can't see him. Yeah, so you disagree completely with Harris he doesn't disagree completely John.

John: 1:35:22

I said sometimes, like what you said about the food, the shelter and all that Not having to worry about shit. Go on vacation, enjoy yourself a little bit yeah, but how are you? Going to enjoy yourself. You're saying it's all about the money, right? Money makes life easier With the 6K you said.

Harris: 1:35:40

I never said 6K bro.

John: 1:35:42

Yes, you did no Watch the replay.

Harris: 1:35:47

No one ever said $6,000,.

John: 1:35:48

John, I think you were fucking dumb. You said six figures.

Harris: 1:35:51

Six figures. Six figures is not 6K. Six figures is 100K and up. Oh wow, You're good at math. What is wrong with you? Six figures is not $6,000. You said both Six figures is 100K and up Seven figures is what what?

Mike: 1:36:09

a million up how are you going to be a millionaire if you don't know how to count a million? You fool. Six figures is a hundred there's no chance there's no chance for you to become a millionaire. There is a chance without doing something stupid, like you tried to do last week.

John: 1:36:26

Fuck you what did he try to do last week?

Harris: 1:36:30

He tried to cut off his finger.

Toliy: 1:36:31

He was pretending that he was tough and he's going to cut off his finger.

John: 1:36:35

Eldar was going to cut my finger off.

Harris: 1:36:39

Eldar wasn't here last week Two weeks ago he was pretending that he was tough and that he's this big bad guy. Cut off your finger right now. I'm still going skydiving. I don't care what you guys say. You could be a little scaredy cat.

Mike: 1:36:54

You're scared of pretty much everything, harris, and money's not going to help you with fear. Totally Anything you want to add to our good friend Harris here, final thoughts type of thing you had enough, right, yeah, man. Your brain is shutting down.

Harris: 1:37:12

Tommy after Tommy, shit I have a lot. Of my patience is gone.

Toliy: 1:37:18

You have to yank one out twice after that speech from Tommy.

Harris: 1:37:22

What is wrong with?

Toliy: 1:37:23

you what the fuck? Yeah, I would say my final thoughts are like on I'm not even sure what subject, but everything that we discussed is that, yeah, I would say that if you don't know something and you have the balls to ask, you'll probably be in a good place.

Harris: 1:37:44

I know what you're hinting at. I'm not hinting at anything I don't think you know, anything but loud and clear. I don't think you know anything Loud and clear.

Mike: 1:37:52

Yeah, I think the question is how do you develop that ability to I don't know? Is it give up? Fire yourself, say you don't know? How do you get to that point? Can you get to that point? Is there a shortcut or not even shortcut, but is there a path to get there? That point, is there a shortcut or not even shortcut, but is there a path to get there? Um, or is it just like, hey, this is the life that you kind of predestined to live and you, you will get there or you won't get there? Is it natural selection, like you know all?

Toliy: 1:38:18

those things. Well it's well. It's definitely a survival of the fittest type of scenario you think it's survival if you're like a, a weak donkey like harris, not to name any names like Harris.

Mike: 1:38:28

Okay, yeah.

Toliy: 1:38:29

Harris with one R then, fuck you, not you. I said Harris with one R, is it more than one?

Harris: 1:38:35

R Harris, ryan Schuster, fuck you nobody said your name.

Toliy: 1:38:38

Yeah, not you, harris, just a different Harris you don't know no other Harris man he's also overweight too yeah, like, if you're, yeah, if you're gonna be that kind of weak prey, then you're gonna get like life will come at you. But if you develop yourself and you get better like I guess, at life if you want to just say that, or you begin to actually understand things and are able to ask questions, are able to be humble, give yourself the opportunity to learn and to do, then I think that you will survive and you will be more fit. Right, you will be not necessarily the fittest, but you will be more fit than what you are now and then from there you could go on the journey of becoming and actually um have more control over your destiny. Then I think that, um, if you don't go that route, then I don't think you have control of your destiny. You're gonna live out um, whatever kind of like fortune that you're in right.

Toliy: 1:39:45

So if you grow, if you get born into like a rich, like family, and you just kind of like, do like rich things and have like money and do these vacations and do all that, you'll live out that kind of life. If you um get born into like poor, like a poor family, like you may just be, like you know, poor physically and mentally, your whole life, um, or like if, or like, yeah, the example of being rich you might be rich, money wise, but you're going to be very poor, like mentally. So whatever you're born into, whatever the situation is, you're just going to live it out and that is most likely, uh, pre predetermined, like it's very easy to like to forecast, you know totally, I agree with you.

Mike: 1:40:29

But the question is, I guess the question it's not a question, I guess it's all your space on what you're saying. It's like, uh, that it is part of, like uh, survival of the fittest. It is, depending on your circumstance, but what can someone do if they like, I guess, what can someone do to understand something they don't understand and choose to live a different way? You know, like, how does one get so, I don't know, fortunate or yeah.

Toliy: 1:40:55

Well, the thing is, that like, like I feel like when we ask this kind of questions, it's like like I don't know what to say, like what can?

Mike: 1:41:03

you tell somebody to do.

Toliy: 1:41:05

I also don't know what to say, but there's like I feel like it's very hard to come up with an answer for this, because any answer that you give, you'll think that the answer is too complicated, because it is a complicated and difficult scenario and I don't think there needs to be an answer to this kind of stuff.

Toliy: 1:41:30

To be an answer to this kind of stuff like um, because I think that if there was a clear like 100 way, um, like you, you would have more like uh, sellouts and certain things like right, like just doing the things to get like kind of like a results oriented thing.

Toliy: 1:41:42

But I think a lot of these concepts that we talk about they kind of like um, they naturally require to get put in more of like a humble scenario where you kind of like are almost feeling that like you're getting nothing but like you're gonna eventually get everything at the same time, and it's like a risk that like like um, you kind of take like where, where it's like you either put yourself in like a vulnerable position or, um, you have to like reveal certain things about yourself, or you have to like bring out ugly things about you, um, like habits you have or ways you have of talking or doing things, um, and I think that, like you, doing all that and then getting good rewards for it, is a better scenario than having these cookie-cutter things. Okay, follow. Step one is this, then step two is this, and then, once you reach step 12, you've accomplished X. No for sure.

Mike: 1:42:44

I don't think there's a thing like that, but I think at least what comes to my mind is you should suffer as much as possible, as fast as possible. Yeah, go test those theories that you believe in and don't hesitate, go in there with your head like bullet, like this bull here from New Jersey. Yeah, the faster you bullet, the faster you realize. The faster you bullet, the faster you realize, and hopefully whether it's some intelligence, some luck, I don't know predeterminism, survival of the fittest that you understand what needs to be understood. But I think the fastest route like I think Jim Carrey said it, he wants everybody to get rich as fast as possible.

Mike: 1:43:24

I think he did use that like as soon as possible or as fast as possible. I think he did say that, I'm not sure Because then you realize that this shit is not it. You know, and I think that goes for anything, not just making money, I think, just the, the, all the attachments that we have developed and things that we bought into. Go test those theories as soon as possible, you know, like um, and I think that might help you get to where you need to be, at least for what I believe is where we need to be in order to live a good, happy life. Yeah.

Toliy: 1:43:56

One thing I also just thought about Harris. He brought up an example before he was saying that Jeff Bezos is the man. Jeff Bezos is this right. Like, jeff Bezos is the man, jeff Bezos is this right. Let me just well actually I don't have my iPhone charging, but if we Googled Jeff Bezos net worth, what do you think we'll see?

Mike: 1:44:18

$100 billion, maybe $150 billion.

Toliy: 1:44:22

Okay, $200 billion, yeah, $200 billion right, 200 billion right. Nfl teams currently sell for between about like 4 billion and like 4 to like 6 billion dollar range. Right, there was just recently an NFL team for sale and Jeff Bezos was willing to offer the most amount of money for it.

Mike: 1:44:52

And maybe we can ask Harry the answer to the question you're about to ask, right?

Toliy: 1:44:56

What do you think happened when he offered the most? The Washington Commanders, which were the Washington Redskins, were for sale and he offered the most amount of money for it and was willing to keep topping that because, like, he's in a position where, what, like, what's four billion? Yeah right, you don't have to even pay that cash, you can finance it like you know. Billion, right, yeah, what's 10 billion?

Toliy: 1:45:19

what's 15 billion dollars, right, so so he can afford it like and double pay for it if he wants, it's not gonna be a blink of an eye, right, because you also don't even have to have that money in cash like you could get financed by, like a black rock or one of these companies, right, um, um, what do you think happened when he offered the most amount of money for it? Paris? What do you think? No, why? Why? Why do you think that they said no because in order to buy an nfl team, for example? Uh-huh right, or to buy any team?

Toliy: 1:45:48

in these leagues the other owners have to agree that you would be a good fit to own a team and they have to vote like they have to approve of you. And the owners did not approve the sale to him because they think he's a piece of shit.

Toliy: 1:46:03

Harris that's your boy man. So even though he had all this money, he couldn't even buy what he wanted with it, because the peers in this league, which are all also like they're all billionaire Owners, right, so I'm guessing they have some kind of some kind of relationship or like something leads them to not want to do this, right? Mm-hmm, they said no go.

Mike: 1:46:24

Fuck yourself, harris, I guess you can't. Money doesn't solve everything. Paris has a picture of Jeff in his wallet. Fuck yourself, harris, I guess you can't.

John: 1:46:28

Money doesn't solve everything.

Toliy: 1:46:29

Harris has a picture of Jeff in his wallet Instead it went to somebody else who offered less, but the owners agreed to sell it to this person.

Mike: 1:46:39

A like-minded individual, because he was a piece of shit.

Harris: 1:46:42

Jeff Bezos.

Toliy: 1:46:44

They didn't want him in, he could have offered a double. He could have said like oh, you guys want six, I'll give you 12. But the guy can't sell to them without, like, the approval of all the other owners.

Harris: 1:46:57

Really, yeah, Jeff Bezos. Final guess how much is net worth?

Mike: 1:47:02

Nobody cares. He's broke as fuck. He's a loser from Poughkeepsie $211 billion.

Harris: 1:47:06

Who cares about?

John: 1:47:06

that.

Toliy: 1:47:07

He could even buy a $4 billion.

John: 1:47:08

team Hires has a tattoo of Jeff and his booty.

Mike: 1:47:11

Yeah, if you get a tattoo of him, I'll pay $1,000 on it.

Harris: 1:47:14

I'm good thanks $2,000.

Mike: 1:47:17

No $5,000. That's a lot of money. You could buy a lot of hot dogs with that, fuck yeah.

Toliy: 1:47:23

From the stairs $ 5,000 cash.

Mike: 1:47:30

Think about it, Don't say no. The offer does expire at the end of the day One. Two.

Harris: 1:47:35

Shut up you throwing anything on that.

Toliy: 1:47:38

Me yeah, I'll throw 500. That ain't nothing, bro.

Mike: 1:47:44

Wait till we get older on it?

Harris: 1:47:47

Where does the tattoo have to be man.

Mike: 1:47:50

On your face. Fuck yeah, Okay fine.

John: 1:47:52

It's got to be right here.

Harris: 1:47:55

Any other ideas?

Mike: 1:47:58

Yeah, yeah, you're right. Tully About that. If you're a piece of shit, nobody wants to deal with you, no matter how much money you got.

Toliy: 1:48:05

Nope, you can move some things around, you can buy something or whatever. Nope, you can move some things around, you can buy something or whatever. Yeah. But he wanted the football team. He couldn't even get that. Yeah, you know, yeah, even though he would have been the richest, older by like crazy amount X.

Mike: 1:48:21

And I guess also another thing is like how did the people that for the that work for this you know, this guy right, all the people right, um, he's got 200 billion, but a lot of people that work for him they're complaining about salary, unfair wages, unfair treatment, have not having uh, certain you know humane things he's not in charge of amazon anymore.

Mike: 1:48:46

He dropped, stepped down okay he was in charge of some other guy yeah, but in general, before he stepped down, there were complaints, I think Harris yeah, and he took care of it. Would you like to be a person that everybody hates? Millions of people hate, you know, but you'll be the richest person in the world. Would you be okay with that?

Harris: 1:49:04

I'm going to correct you there. He took care of the problems.

John: 1:49:07

How did he take care of the problems?

Harris: 1:49:08

One of the employees emailed him about how Not enough.

John: 1:49:13

Show us the email? Yeah, please. I just read about this.

Harris: 1:49:15

One of the employees talked about emailing him On TMZ After Wait, okay, she was on medical leave and she was not receiving part of her check. She complained about it, blah blah. She emailed jeff bezos, who was not the ceo at the time anymore, and he looked into it. He hired investigators, blah blah blah, and he ended up starting a whole investigation into the thing because he still owned shares in the company anyway.

Mike: 1:49:44

needless to say, it was fixed okay, one person out of a million, plus people that work for him.

Harris: 1:49:49

Everyone's medical leave was fixed because it started a whole investigation into the handling of this.

John: 1:49:54

Where'd you find this fake information? Fakewikipediacom.

Harris: 1:49:59

Fake news right, the woman actually talked about it.

Mike: 1:50:02

Yeah, alright, but you know, like I said, harris, he's one of those people.

Harris: 1:50:11

That is not taking his wealth or passing it down to family members. He is donating it.

Mike: 1:50:17

Are you related to him? Is that why you feel like you like him so much?

Harris: 1:50:21

No, so he's not such a piece of shit. He's donating all his money once he dies.

Mike: 1:50:25

Okay, Sounds good. I don't think you can be not a piece of shit and be so wealthy while uh, you know.

Harris: 1:50:36

So you're saying all these most of the rich building as a piece of shit.

Mike: 1:50:41

I'm not sure if you can get there in such a way. That's gonna be like, uh, you know, honest, virtuous. I'm not sure if you understand when it comes to money, that's not important.

Harris: 1:50:55

But overall, you know you got it yeah, but we all have our opinions, right absolutely, has absolutely opinions are like assholes Everybody got one. Don't use that. That belongs to the Schuster family man.

Mike: 1:51:13

Oh yeah, you guys mean that I wouldn't in the 1400s, with Christopher Columbus came to America. Your mom said that.

Harris: 1:51:18

No, my aunt, your aunt at Toey. No, Aunt Attoley, here is taking what my aunt used to say, what I told him. Excuses are like assholes, everyone has one the.

Mike: 1:51:30

If you go on Wikipedia actually look up that quote, it is actually by Jeff, by Jeff Schuster, okay what are you talking? About it says Jeff Schuster, yeah the creator of that quote yeah, go fuck yourself.

Harris: 1:51:43

I think they go fuck yourself, go fuck yourself, fuck you you got your goddamn mind.

Toliy: 1:51:48

Get out your goddamn mind, boy.

Mike: 1:51:51

All right, guys. Harris, final thought I hope you're not as dumb as you look.

Harris: 1:51:57

That's the same. Okay, mom, I'm coming over to you.

Mike: 1:52:02

I was just backing up on what Tully was saying. He said yo Harris is just pretending, so I'm hoping that he's accurate okay for a good one, for a good measure. All right guys, thank you. Thanks for watching.