191. Beauty

Are you trying to organize your life, or are you just trying to organize your mind?

We often view weight loss and beauty as purely physical pursuits—counting calories, hitting the gym, or buying aesthetic fillers. But what if the "ugly" parts of us aren’t physical at all? What if they are rooted in anxiety, stress, and mental chaos?

In this episode, we break down the philosophy of True Beauty as a form of Order. We explore Toliy’s recent 30-pound weight loss journey, uncovering why it felt "effortless" this time around. The secret wasn't a new diet; it was addressing the invisible stressors, fixing sleep habits, and removing the "chaos" from the mind first.

If you are tired of the "start-stop" cycle of self-improvement, this conversation will shift your perspective from fighting the symptoms to fixing the root cause.

In this episode, we discuss:

• The Definition of True Beauty: Why beauty is actually a reflection of peace, order, and symmetry, while "ugliness" is often a manifestation of internal chaos and stress.
• The "Mind Loss" Connection: Why you cannot change your body if your mind is occupied with fear and anxiety.
• The Domino Effect of Habits: How fixing your sleep and morning routine naturally leads to better nutritional choices without "discipline."
• Intention vs. The Math: Why understanding why you eat is infinitely more important than what you eat.

💡 Most Insightful Moment: "The math is not the math. If you eat more, you get fatter. Now the math is: 'Why do you eat more?' ... The results are not just the weight loss or gain. It's 'Mind Loss.' You become a conspiracy theorist... you start blaming the world. You take away your own accountability." — Mike

Ready to declutter your mind and body? If you enjoyed this episode, please leave us a 5-star review and share this link with a friend who needs to hear this today.

Feel stuck and can't actualize? We'd love to hear your story - we can even dissect it on our next episode. Submit your story using this form - https://forms.gle/joegCWQ7mHt7eN3K9

Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction to Beauty and Self-Improvement
• 2:37 Aura and Personal Growth
• 18:23 The Importance of Education and Self-Discovery
• 40:13 The Evolution of Personal Growth
• 49:19 The Importance of Self-Examination
• 1:06:34 Free Will and Predeterminism
• 1:14:32 Final Thoughts on Beauty and Life's Purpose

Transcript

[00:00:00] Eldar: Things that we want to change about ourselves are rooted in beauty, like the true sense of beauty. Yeah. We're trying to organize 

[00:00:07] Toliy: our life or 

[00:00:08] Eldar: organize our 

[00:00:08] Toliy: mind. Well, I think we're trying to live beautifully. It's a crazy like underestimation as to how like particular like stressors or ways of doing things or ways of viewing things, how much weight they carry for a person.

[00:00:24] Eldar: I think that's what we're after for shit. That's evergreen. Yeah. Not the shit that you put on your fucking lips, the fillers. It's that spark in your eye. The window to the soul. Mm. Right. That stays actually that way.

[00:00:42] All right guys. Tonight's topic is beauty. What does something make beautiful? How does it come about? Why do we call it beautiful and not, we're not talking necessarily about. You know, necessarily aesthetic maybe, right? 

[00:00:54] Mm-hmm. You know how 

[00:00:55] they say the beauty is in the beholder? 

[00:00:56] Mm-hmm. 

[00:00:57] Right? Or maybe the eye of the beholder.

[00:00:59] The eye of the beholder, right? Yeah. Maybe like, you know, somebody might, might not look aesthetically pleasing, let's just say, but their eyes might tell a different story, you know? Uh, but one example that we have, for example, uh, why I wanted to bring up this example is because I think that there's a process to maybe be becoming more, not only aesthetically pleasing, but uh, better as a person and everything else, right?

[00:01:24] When you craft yourself and totally example of losing weight, you went from 248 pounds and a half to 2 28. I mean, I'm sorry, two 18. 

[00:01:34] Mm-hmm. 

[00:01:35] Okay, so it's 30 pounds. So he's in that process of losing weight, finally focusing on it, right? Mm-hmm. Uh, because prior to, to actually finally focusing on this, he had a lot of distractions.

[00:01:45] He had a lot of things going on. But now he found, I would say focus. Maybe he found some peace, right? And slowly he's chipping away and chiseling himself away, um, to, to a specimen that he wants to be right, versus someone he, that he wasn't himself attracted to, right? As a person. Maybe he didn't like something about himself, um, but now he is, right?

[00:02:12] So I'd like to talk about these processes. What are something, what are some of these types of processes that allow us to kind of, uh, form ourselves in such a way where we become more, not only attracted to ourselves and pleased with ourselves, but also then the world has the ability to also recognize that, like, oh, wow, like that that person's got something, you know?

[00:02:37] What do they call that nowadays? Aura. 

[00:02:39] Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. 

[00:02:40] Aura Farming. Yeah. I've, I've heard this on All Island. Yeah. Heard this. Yeah. It's pretty crazy, right? Oh, really? 

[00:02:44] Mike: People are already on the wounds already. Yeah, because this is like a new thing that just happened recently. Oh, 

[00:02:48] Eldar: yeah. No, all these that I heard about.

[00:02:50] I only heard it like on social media a little bit, and I heard on social media. Yeah. It's 

[00:02:53] Toliy: big on like the, uh, dreamers. Like they Oh, okay. They always talk about this. Yeah. 

[00:02:57] Eldar: So I don't know if they know what they're talking about, but like, I guess maybe they do. Um, you know, but like, it's like an aura, right?

[00:03:02] Mm-hmm. We're talking about an aura of an individual, like that beauty where it's like, wow, like they onto something. Like they give off maybe some kind of a, you know, they represent something. Mm-hmm. You know, or whatever. So what do you think about that? Like, uh, what do you guys think? Is there an actual process to get there to this point?

[00:03:21] Um, is that something that you've, you earn yourself? Is that something that you develop? Uh, is that something that just, somebody just looks at you and applies that upon you? Because it's the eye of the beholder, let's just say, you know, who's able to extract that from you? Is it something that you actually work on and then, uh, illuminate into the world?

[00:03:41] I guess that would depend on which, uh, way you go about doing it. Mm-hmm. Okay. What does that mean? Well, oh, you mean the intention behind it? 

[00:03:49] Mike: Yeah. Like plenty of people lose weight. Yeah. But they still stay ugly. This is true. You know, this is true. Um, yeah. And I'm not just saying the end result, but also the process as well.

[00:03:59] Yeah. It could be ugly, the process 

[00:04:01] Eldar: could be ugly, 

[00:04:02] Mike: you know, 

[00:04:03] Eldar: this is true. So, okay. So then, okay, so you're saying a couple of things. So there might be variables where beauty requires, or let's just say true beauty requires, um, the right intention 

[00:04:13] mm-hmm. 

[00:04:14] The right process, 

[00:04:16] right. And what else? And the outcome is the outcome.

[00:04:20] Yeah. Right. What do you think about that to, 

[00:04:24] Toliy: yeah, no, I mean that makes sense. 

[00:04:27] Eldar: Um, do you think you're striking it right now with this, with this attempt of yours? 

[00:04:32] Toliy: Yeah, I mean, it's, it's like a funny phenomenon because like, this has always been like so, so hard for me and so difficult to think about doing this.

[00:04:40] Mm-hmm. Starting, and like, it's gonna take so long and like, you know, all this stuff. But like, um, as, as, as I've gone through the process, like it, it baffles me how like easy it is, you know? Wow. Like, like it just, just like, like, like if I just look back, I can't believe it. Like it's already been like, you know, 30 pounds.

[00:05:00] Like Yeah. I know. That to me sounded like, you know, fall, even 10, fall 10 pounds sounded like absurd because like everyone knows like, yeah. How much first off you have to like, work out or like, burn off, for example, in comparison to like what you eat. Like, it's like a funny like thing. Yeah. Like, you know, like if you have like one big meal mm-hmm.

[00:05:20] You have to endlessly exercise just to burn that off. And then like, um, like in the beginning when I was, um, um. Starting, I was just like, oh, wow. Like, you know, like, you know, you did this, this, this, and this. And then you have like, you know, one good meal and then you have a bad meal, and then it's like, oh, it's like two pounds up 

[00:05:40] Eldar: Hmm.

[00:05:41] Toliy: Outta nowhere. Just like that. Just like that, you know? Sure. So like, yeah. That, that was like the, the, uh, beginning times. But yeah, now for me, it, I mean it's like more of like a, um, definitely like a lifestyle change. Like I, uh, um, yeah, I just feel like ev everything's different, but it's what clicked, what clicked, what's the ingredient 

[00:06:01] Eldar: that clicked?

[00:06:02] Yeah. I mean, what, what clicked? Um, 'cause you'd like to know what clicks, right? Because if you can click this, this is just weight. Yeah. We're talking about weight, right. But, but now it's like you could be applied to many different things. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Right. Yeah. In your lifestyle. So like, especially if it's one that's working for you that you actually enjoy.

[00:06:19] And then, like you said, maybe you're developing a stronger character and everything else. And people now are also like, oh wow. Like he represents a, this type of lifestyle. You know what I mean? 

[00:06:29] Toliy: Yeah. I feel like what clicked, what, what clicked? Um, yeah. Yeah. I think that like when you're, um, like ev every person, um, is occupied with like particular things and like if, if, if you ask somebody like, hey, like, what's your life like?

[00:06:47] Or like, what are you occupied with? Right? They, they might tell you like the, uh, they're busy. The Z ones, they're, oh, they, uh, work, you know, okay. They, uh, sleep, you know, um, they do this, they're committed to like this sport or like, they work out. Like they'll, they'll tell, tell you like what their day is like.

[00:07:06] But, um, I think that that, like, the funny part of all this is, is that when someone tells you what they're occupied with, um, the things that, that, that they're not telling you, um, I think it's usually those things that actually take up the most, like time and effort. Like in some someone's life. And I feel like it's a crazy, like, um, like underestimate how, like an un underestimation as as to how, like particular like stressors or ways of doing things or ways of viewing things, talk about how much weight they, um, they carry for a person.

[00:07:45] Eldar: Mm. 

[00:07:45] Toliy: You know? Um, and, but, but it's difficult because a person who's gonna be answering that question, they'll never tell you that, that like, hey, like a lot of my time is actually occupied with stress, anxiety, you know, anxiety. Yeah. Fear. Fear for example. Yeah. Right. All, all of those things that are like ki of, of like, um, invisible, but they're, um, they're, they're, um, blockers for, for that person.

[00:08:13] So, so would you say that those things are actually the, the, the ugly about us? Those are definitely the ugly about us. And, and, and, and like the crazy thing is that a lot of these things, things are like. You can call them choices, but it's difficult to call them choices because to the person, like they're just part of who they are, or they're like a bit like, um, invisible, you know, almost.

[00:08:38] Yeah. They haven't been examine in a while, so it's like, I don't think like they're making actual choices to like be like this or do like this. They're, they're just kind of part of who they are. Mm-hmm. So, um, for them to like change or let go of those kinds of things, it's very, um, difficult. But like any of these types of good changes that you wanna make in your life, they need like a space, you know.

[00:09:05] But if your, if your life is ooc occupied with like, fear, anxiety, and like stress, then I don't think you'll actually be able to change any of those things, you know? 

[00:09:15] Eldar: Um, most of our goals and things that we want to change about ourselves are rooted in beauty.

[00:09:23] Toliy: Well, I think they're like rooted in like, trying to be happy or trying to like accomplish things their life, which is probably beauty. True beauty. 

[00:09:31] Mike: Like the true sense of beauty. Yeah. 

[00:09:33] Eldar: Right. We're trying to organize our life or organize our mind. 

[00:09:38] Toliy: Yeah. Right. Why? Well, I think we're trying to live beautifully, right?

[00:09:42] Yes. Like that, that that's what the goal is. Yeah. Like you could say like, yeah. The, uh, like what makes up happiness or like, living well, or like mm-hmm. Living a particular way is a, yeah. Like you, you try trying to understand how to properly go about life. Like, like that's what it is. Okay. For me at least.

[00:10:00] Like how, like how do you properly live so that you could, um, enjoy your different aspects of your life and so that you could, um, feel good. Yeah. 

[00:10:13] Eldar: Anxiety, stress, messiness. Disorganization, scatterbrain, all this stuff represents very specific thing. Mm-hmm. And then order, right. Organization, right. Uh, symmetry, you know, focus.

[00:10:32] Represent another thing, there's a clear, two clear differences. Right. One is ugly, right? Mm-hmm. A chaotic mind that's all over the place. Everything's all over the place. You know, problems everywhere. You know? I mean, we saw it the other day. 

[00:10:49] Yeah. 

[00:10:50] The representation of someone's chaos, right on their face.

[00:10:54] Mm-hmm. 

[00:10:55] Um, it's clear as day. It's clear. There's no peace, there's no order, there's nothing, you know, but when you have peace, when you have order, when you have focus, right, then you have structure, the things that you put out right in your life first starting with yourself, you know, with your own personal hygiene, personal wellness, you know.

[00:11:18] Maybe it'll transform into his car, his house, and things will start getting into more in order. 

[00:11:25] Mm-hmm. 

[00:11:25] Because obviously if you ask anyone, I would think, right, you want a messy house, messy car, or you want a, you know, organize car. 

[00:11:33] Mm-hmm. 

[00:11:34] Organized house. I mean, who would pick a messy house? Right. For example, everybody will strive towards beauty, of course.

[00:11:42] Right. A nice manicured lawn, nice manicured this, this and the third, you know, in such a way where it's ordered in accordance to some kind of symmetry that when you look at it, it looks nice, but if you represent the face of anxiety, 

[00:11:56] stress, fear. Right. What is that? Chaos. Mm-hmm. What do you guys have? 

[00:12:05] Mike: I don't know.

[00:12:05] I got nothing, but I agree. Like, you know, what you're saying makes perfect sense to me. Mm-hmm. Like, uh, everything you said about what true beauty looks like, and the opposite looks like it's for sure. 

[00:12:18] Eldar: All right. So should we not strive then if we want this in into our lives, number one, strive to get our shit together, order our life properly in such a way where it is, represents beauty and beautiful, and then also seek that out an individual that you want to, for example, live with.

[00:12:34] You know? Yeah. You wanna journey this life with, you know, who also represents that same thing? I mean, obviously it's hard. Yeah. You know, uh, to get all your shit in order. 

[00:12:44] Mike: Everybody's working on different things at different times, you know, 

[00:12:48] Eldar: like totally said, A lot of times you don't even recognize that you are working on some stuff.

[00:12:51] Mm-hmm. Or you preoccupied your mind's preoccupied with this specific thing. You don't even put a lot of thought into it, but it's like, really, there's a lot of weight there. There is. Right. That's holding you away from 

[00:13:01] mm-hmm. 

[00:13:01] Losing 30 pounds and not really flinching, like, I got this. Mm-hmm. You know what I mean?

[00:13:05] Like, uh, no problem. Now, you know, autopilot. Mm-hmm. You know, the structure's there, the order is there. Now it's like, oh, I fit right into it. I, I like it. Mm-hmm. I enjoy. You know now, like when did we ever see Totally say, come to office and say, I'm not eating today. Like, are you kidding me? Mm-hmm. You know what I mean?

[00:13:22] Yeah. And I'm not saying that that's beauty or whatever, but like that's a level of self-control. Yeah. At least in this department. Mm-hmm. That's never been seen before. 

[00:13:29] Mike: Yeah. 

[00:13:30] Eldar: You know, so there's some kind of, definitely some kind of ingredient where like if we do want to get our shit together, where we do want to structure our life and become more beautiful, we need to remove some of this stuff.

[00:13:39] Again, going back to your, your, your philosophy too. 

[00:13:42] Yeah. 

[00:13:43] That a lot of times, you know, we have a lot of, so many different distractions. Tony doesn't want to give away the secrets. He's doing it. 

[00:13:49] Toliy: No, no, no. Like, like I'm, I'm tracking it back and I'm, and I'm like trying to understand like, do 

[00:13:54] Eldar: you not see that something's different or No.

[00:13:56] Toliy: Yeah. No, I definitely see that something is different 

[00:13:58] Eldar: because if you're shooting in the dark, you're like, 

[00:14:00] Toliy: bro, like, no. Get ready to pick out and gain a 30 pounds back. No, I'm definitely not. No. Like it, I mean, like. My life before was consumed with like, chaos. Chaos and anxiety and like crazy fears. Mm-hmm.

[00:14:13] And like a bunch of different like problems, you know? And I wanted to do everything all at the same time, but did not like nothing, you know? Mm-hmm. Um, but now you've structured a little bit and you have, 

[00:14:28] Eldar: you zeroed in and focused. 

[00:14:30] Toliy: Yeah. But, but, but it's been like, um, like there's been particular things to like fix, like one thing was, um, working on like the anxiety and like the, uh, and like particular fears for example.

[00:14:42] Right. Because like with that, for me, always came consistently bad sleep. 

[00:14:45] Eldar: Mm-hmm. 

[00:14:47] Toliy: Then like, um, I worked on that and then I got, you know, started to get better sleep. 

[00:14:52] Eldar: Mm-hmm. You know? Yeah. 

[00:14:53] Toliy: And the better sleep then transformed into like, um, I started putting a focus on like my mornings, for example. 

[00:15:01] Eldar: Mm-hmm.

[00:15:02] Toliy: Yeah. I wanted a very specific like. Like my, my mornings were chaotic right away. I, I would, I would have crazy chaos with doing everything like, like waking up late, doing like everything last minute, stressing about the whole process. Rushing through everything. Yeah. And I started every day already feeling bad, so it was like, 

[00:15:20] Eldar: hmm mm-hmm 

[00:15:21] Toliy: are, are you, are you gonna have like a, a a good day when you feel bad right away?

[00:15:27] So then like I kept dialing back like my like, um, like, um, trying to wake up earlier. And sometimes it was easier. Sometimes it was hard, harder. Um, and, um, I kept doing that. Uh, and like there was plenty of mornings I had like, even before I started to like, you know, walk or like do any kind of exercise where like, I just had plenty of time and I was literally like, like if, if someone observed me, like I'm doing like nothing, pretty much, I'm just doing everything super slow, you know, like.

[00:15:58] Like making your coffee and drinking it, and then just like sitting down for 45 minutes, like, it's like a ridiculously 

[00:16:04] Eldar: mm-hmm. 

[00:16:05] Toliy: Like, it's like too much time to, to do that, you know? Mm-hmm. Like, it's like, uh, people would probably look at that and be like, oh, you could be more productive, or you could do more like 

[00:16:13] Eldar: Yeah.

[00:16:14] Toliy: Things, but I wanted the opposite. I wanted plenty of time to like do nothing basically. Yeah. You know? So I was doing that for like, a good amount of time, and then I kept scaling my, like, wake up times, you know, to kept going earlier and earlier. Mm-hmm. Um, and trying to figure out like, what's the right time?

[00:16:31] Like what, what time works, works for you, you know? 

[00:16:33] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:16:34] Toliy: Um, and so, yeah, like those to me were like the, uh, like the, the stress, the anxiety, and then the, um, the sleep. Now I get like, you know, I rarely wake up or I rarely, now for me, like getting bad sleep is like rare. Mm-hmm. You know? Yeah. Or getting good, good sleep now is very normal.

[00:16:55] Mm-hmm. You know? Um. Yeah. Then, then, then that turned into, um, yeah, so it was like the night stuff, the, the asleep and then the mornings, and then I think that turned into just like more observation. Like I just had more time to observe and yourself Yeah. To like self-reflect and like analyze and just like, yeah.

[00:17:16] Just like 

[00:17:16] Eldar: mm-hmm. 

[00:17:17] Toliy: Think about things, you know? Mm-hmm. And then I think from there it, uh, naturally came 

[00:17:21] Eldar: better choices. 

[00:17:22] Toliy: Yeah. Then came, yeah, like more desires for more good things. And, um, like when my, when my, uh, mind was not as busy or occupied with, um, crazy stress or crazy anxiety mm-hmm. Then it started to have more like free time 

[00:17:40] Eldar: mm-hmm.

[00:17:42] Toliy: In that kind of way, which to me is a completely different way than talking about like free time. 'cause like, it doesn't matter whether you're, I don't know, like unemployed and like not doing anything or you're, um, like. Have like five jobs and you're like, you know, doing like a crazy amount in, in that kind of way.

[00:18:01] Both people could be equally as busy 

[00:18:05] Eldar: Yeah. With 

[00:18:05] Toliy: how they go about things. 

[00:18:06] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:18:07] Toliy: So what, so, so it's not necessarily like a time thing, it's more of like, what is your mind occupied with? And, and I feel like a lot of the times people don't r realize that they're actually super busy 

[00:18:19] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:18:20] Toliy: In their mind Yeah.

[00:18:21] With doing nothing, you know? Hmm. And, um, I dunno if you remember, but when I started trying to think about all these things like years ago, and I asked you, and you told me like, you have no time. Mm-hmm. You know, like you're, um, 

[00:18:33] Eldar: yeah. 

[00:18:34] Toliy: You're, you're completely booked. 

[00:18:36] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:18:36] Toliy: You know, and I didn't understand like, what that meant or like 

[00:18:40] Eldar: Yeah.

[00:18:40] Toliy: Any of that. Because to me it's like, what do you mean I have plenty of time? Yeah. Whatcha talking about? Yeah. You know, but I, but, but I was, I was like mentally fully booked, you know? Yeah. So yeah, that's how I feel it happened. And then when it started to. To like start. And then, um, when like progress started, started to happen, I was always observing the progress.

[00:19:01] I was always observing what was going on. And then I got to a point where, um, like beyond like the, uh, like seeing actual results, I saw results in like how I felt. Mm-hmm. And then how I could process things. And then like, um, when, when I did do have like, stress, like what do I turn into? Do I turn into wanting to like veg out and like escape?

[00:19:26] Mm-hmm. Or am I able just to use my mind and now think, you know? Mm-hmm. So I feel like now I'm able to use my mind more and think 

[00:19:33] Eldar: Mm. 

[00:19:35] Toliy: Um, rather than want to, like, now 

[00:19:36] Eldar: you have a choice in the matter. 

[00:19:38] Toliy: Yeah. 

[00:19:40] Eldar: Okay. 

[00:19:40] Toliy: Yeah. So I, so I definitely like, overall I feel like not comparably, like as far as like sharper, I feel better.

[00:19:48] Um, yeah. Like it's like. 

[00:19:52] Eldar: I definitely don't wanna change things. Um, is this a fluke? 

[00:20:00] Toliy: No. I mean, I don't think so. Alright, good. 

[00:20:02] Eldar: Yeah, I don't think it's a fluke. Yeah. Because you've done fluke flukes before. You've caught flukes before. 

[00:20:07] Toliy: Yeah. Plenty of times. Yeah. But not like this all, you know? Yeah. That's good.

[00:20:11] You know? 

[00:20:11] Eldar: So, um, yeah, I think, I think that, um, everything, like you said, added up, right? Like all the conversations we used to have about anxiety and also all this other stuff, discipline, you know, and, uh, self-love. I think this is finally our shining through when it comes to his journey, at least when it comes to self-love, where he was able to finally see the noise for the noise that it was, and said to himself, this amount of pain I don't want.

[00:20:39] And he starts to shave away this pain. I don't want this, I don't want that, I don't want this, I don't want that. He finally empowered himself to have a choice in the matter. Uh, it's a natural process that, like you can say that the destiny or the free will 

[00:20:56] mm-hmm. 

[00:20:57] Was given away when the choices were made back then to try to start to think the result of him start losing weight now and going to exactly the weight that he wants to be at, completely happy with himself is the result of all that conversation that was started from, you know, years ago.

[00:21:17] Toliy: Yeah. And, and again, like the funniest thing to me is that like, and this is not discipline. Doing, doing all of it was like, felt like it was so hard and like it was like, you know. Yeah. Like the likelihood of this happening is probably low to like, when I'm in it now, it's like way easier than that. Like I ever, I ever thought it would be.

[00:21:35] There you go. You know, like, it's like that, but you can't like, uh, connect it. You can't connect it. No. 

[00:21:41] Eldar: But you have to be able to put it in words. Totally. Because people out there waiting, man, they want to, they want the sauce. Yeah. But like. Listeners that, for example, if they saw him and they tracked like, yo, he went from anxiety ridden crazy nights, not sleeping bad food, fat, whatever, all the shit, and now they saw this, right?

[00:22:01] How can they see the actual journey? How can they see the actual steps that were taken? How can they see that there was so much work that's behind it and not just see the magic, like gimme the magic. Right. How'd you do it? Well, I mean, you know, for 

[00:22:16] Toliy: like, first off, like, I've been in a very particular, uh, like camp for a long time.

[00:22:22] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:22:23] Toliy: Like of, of the cell development camp for a long time. 

[00:22:26] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:22:26] Toliy: And, um, like on a crazy, I feel like, uh, scrutiny, you know, on like all, all aspects of things, you know, so yeah. Like there's no, like, um, the, the, the magic sauce is just to like, um, listen and be humble. You, you're not gonna be able just to listen and be humble.

[00:22:48] Like it's just like Yeah. To start to think, yeah, you need to actually just like be who you are, do what you do, and that, and like, um, like you, you, you need that process to like start for you to, to uh, to be able to listen, to be able to, um, be more hu um, like humble. Like you have to, like, you, you have to physically do, do things.

[00:23:11] Like you probably have to do bad things, but you have to do bad things. Like consciously. Yeah. Like, no, it doesn't have to be consciously, but just like you have to do it like in a group of people that like, can see what's going on and can point stuff out and can like, tell you particular things. And then you have to be able to, to tough out the process of like the suffering that happens.

[00:23:34] But like, like overall, I mean, I've been like suffering for like many years. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Like all kinds of ups and downs of like. Very high and like very like, like, like high highs and low lows, you know? And the journey's still not over. Uh, no. No. It's not even close. Not even close, close. No. Um, yeah, like I, I never even thought about it, like yet of it being like significant yet, you know, like, 

[00:24:01] Eldar: yeah.

[00:24:02] I think it was still you just peaking peak. It's speaking its head. Yeah. Finally. 

[00:24:06] Toliy: Yeah. 

[00:24:06] Eldar: Mike, you could definitely relate to this, obviously the, the weight loss journey. Yeah. Well, not just weight loss, I think a lot of loss. Yeah. Right. Yeah, of course. A lot of loss where like, you know, uh, you yourself said you used to, you know.

[00:24:18] Remember seeing yourself as the gremlin. Mm-hmm. You know, of overreacting or being angry or mm-hmm. Bottling things up and not being able to speak or communicate, you know, and, um, including weight as well for you. Yeah. Yoing back and forth. Mm-hmm. Losing 50 pounds, a hundred pounds, whatever, you know, just to go back and stuff like that, you know.

[00:24:37] But you also like been keeping the weight off, obviously. 

[00:24:40] Mike: Yeah. 

[00:24:40] Eldar: For your own reasons now, for mm-hmm. Different reasons. Mm-hmm. Very organically, naturally right now. Yeah. I eat 

[00:24:46] Mike: whatever I want. Yeah. 

[00:24:48] Eldar: Yeah, exactly. 

[00:24:48] Mike: I eat whatever, whenever. Mostly I 

[00:24:50] Eldar: really don't. Yeah. And you're generally happy, so 

[00:24:52] Mike: Yeah. Now I want, now I wanna lose weight to mm-hmm.

[00:24:55] To make it easier on my hands. To climb. Yeah. To climb. Yeah, for sure. 

[00:25:00] Eldar: Um, but yeah, like it's good to see, you know what I mean? That type of journey where, um, it wasn't through, I mean, it was definitely painful and it was definitely suffering, but it was a different kind of suffering. It was different kind of pain, you know, it was just maybe more mental.

[00:25:18] To think, to critically think to check yourself many times. Mm-hmm. And check your ego out the door. Check, check your arrogance out the door. Mm-hmm. You know, your pride out the door, you know, those are the things, or anxiety or whatever, you know, where no longer those things serve you or you are much more aware of them.

[00:25:39] Mm-hmm. Being as pains, actual painful, um, things part of you, you know? Um, so you can then finally focus on the things that you actually want to do. And that's when I think it becomes very effortless. It's like, uh, I wanna focus on this. Okay, let's go on this journey. Boom. Wake comes off like that. You know, it's almost like a natural phenomenon.

[00:25:57] Mm-hmm. 

[00:25:58] And I think that process itself, like, like, you know, sure, maybe he complains a little bit here and there, but like it's a lot better than before, you know? Um, they're pulling teeth maybe. Yeah. You know what I mean? Now he's a lot more conscious, a lot more maybe considerate and stuff like that. And doing this.

[00:26:17] Not shoving down his maybe ways down unauthorized. Yeah. I think, um, and overall I think it's just more beautiful. Mm-hmm. That journey, that path where it's like the person's on clear path to victory for themselves and they know how to properly focus, do it, but also be able to talk about it properly.

[00:26:37] Mm-hmm. You know, that means they can actually understand what the fuck they're talking about. Yeah. You know, it's like being able to then become a teacher a little bit, you know? 

[00:26:44] Mm-hmm. 

[00:26:44] And I think that, that, like you said in the beginning, the intention is, needs to be correct. 

[00:26:49] Mike: Yeah. 

[00:26:50] Eldar: You know, in the process, how you doing it.

[00:26:52] Mike: Yeah. Well, yeah. I think it, um, more like I can definitely speak more about the intention. 'cause I think that's really what, like the big, big, um, big thing is like the, the math is not the math. You, if you eat more, you get fatter. Yeah. Now the math is, why do you eat more? And then get fatter. Yeah. Or, you know, gain weight.

[00:27:14] Yeah. It's, we, like, a lot of times I feel like people try to solve the problem. Mm-hmm. They're not doing right math. They're like, oh, this is a result of this. Yeah. And like, eating a lot gets you heavier. It's not, uh, and I think that's the, the big issue is that, and I think it, that's, that goes toward any kind of thing that you're trying to work on.

[00:27:37] A lot of times people are, the correlation is not the causation or That's right. Um, the reason you eat is the reason you're getting fatter. Yeah. Not because you're eating. Mm-hmm. And I think understanding that, I think totally understanding that, you know, like, uh, and mm-hmm. Solving those problems that actually cause him to then engage in that behavior that Yeah.

[00:28:01] You need to pacify yourself. Yeah. The mental stuff. Yeah. You know, so yeah. It's definitely, um. The intention has to be to remove those stressor that cause you then to behave in a, in a way because it's, people can overconsume anything. Yeah. Right. And they do. And they do. They do. It's not just food, it's content, alcohol, whatever.

[00:28:24] Content. Yeah. News. Like people lose their minds over everything. Everything. Yeah. And the results are not just the weight loss or gain. Mm-hmm. It's mind loss, you know? Oh, I like that. You become like a conspiracy theorist. You become a nod. You start blaming the world. You take away your own accountability, your own empowerment.

[00:28:41] Eldar: That's well 

[00:28:41] Mike: said. You know, and then it's like, oh, it's not me. It's, mm-hmm. There's a conspiracy theory that they're trying to inject our food to make us fatter. You know, with all kinds of theories that you just kind of like chasing those, uh, imaginary 

[00:29:00] Eldar: and ultimately become what? Not empowered. No, no. You gave away your power and you complaining all the time.

[00:29:08] Yeah. You know, now it's more powerful. He's more powerful. 

[00:29:12] Mike: Yeah. Actually, that's the whole point actually, uh, on this empowerment and thing. Issue, you know, we're just having a, uh, conversation with Andre. Mm-hmm. After, with, with, uh, with you and then afterwards and Yeah. He starts complaining about this guy, you know, he's tells me this story.

[00:29:27] He's like, this guy in New York, you got elected Ani, whatever his name is. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. The mayor, the mayor. I'm like, okay. He's like, he's like, I feel bad. Uh, he's like, he's angry. I'm like, why? He's like these people, they believe as lies. Mm-hmm. You know? 

[00:29:41] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:29:42] Mike: I'm like, okay, what's the problem? Mm-hmm.

[00:29:45] You know, if these people are, let's just say do dumb enough Yeah. To believe that all these promises that this guy's gonna give him 

[00:29:53] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:29:54] Mike: Then this is normal that they elected him. Like logically this makes sense. Yeah, it makes sense. Yeah, it makes sense. It's supposed to go 

[00:29:59] Eldar: that 

[00:29:59] Mike: way, but these people are not empowered and I've said, yeah.

[00:30:03] I don't, like I said, I don't care about who's the president, who's the mayor. Mm-hmm. I have my own shit. I have to, I have actual power and control over mm-hmm. That I gotta focus on, that I still wanna work on and change. 

[00:30:14] Eldar: Mm-hmm. 

[00:30:15] Mike: So how can I worry about this Ani guy or the Donny Yeah. Donny Trump. 

[00:30:19] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:30:19] Mike: You know, and, and me and him we're having this conversation and he's like, yeah, but I feel bad, man.

[00:30:24] These people, they don't, but nobody's forcing them to like, not think or Yeah. You know, so, 

[00:30:31] Toliy: but, but also that like, like the verdict is still out on, like, if it's, maybe he'll do it. Yeah. Maybe he'll do it. Like, 

[00:30:38] Eldar: like, 

[00:30:38] Toliy: yeah. Yeah. Sure. He believed they're, they're not believing his lies as if like he already lied.

[00:30:43] Yeah. And the term happened and he did the opposite, for example. 

[00:30:46] Mike: Well, general, like, a thing about politicians is that they promise a lot of shit and then nothing 

[00:30:50] Toliy: Yeah. But Sure. But then get done. Yeah. But then it's like, that's like no matter who gets elected, like they're gonna mm-hmm. You know, say some lies.

[00:30:56] Mm-hmm. Someone's gonna get lied to 

[00:30:58] Mike: mm-hmm. 

[00:30:59] Toliy: At the end of the day. Right. Yeah. And that's what I, that's that's true. Yeah. Someone's 

[00:31:02] Mike: gonna get lied to for sure. 

[00:31:03] Toliy: Yeah. Yeah. I feel like the disconnect there is. Um, like, I feel like, um, whether you agree or disagree that people earned, earned their bad lives or not, you know?

[00:31:17] Oh, yeah. And like, if you feel that like it's not earned and it's like misfortune Mm. Then good point. Then you could definitely feel that people are like, like you, you, you, you could definitely feel bad for people, but, um, I think it, it, it would, it would be underestimating what actions people take, what decisions they make, and then where that, um, takes them to.

[00:31:45] And yeah. Um, I feel like a lot of people look at things as it's like, you know, people being oppressed or maybe, you know, again, misfortunes or bad luck or stuff like that, which, um, 

[00:32:00] Mike: you can't, uh, stumble upon a. Bad life, I mean, a good life accidentally. 

[00:32:05] Toliy: Yeah. Like that's a good one. That's a great quote. Yeah.

[00:32:09] So if like, if that's true, then I don't think you can stumble upon a bad life accidentally either, 

[00:32:13] Mike: right? Well, actually, um, I think you can blindly 

[00:32:21] Toliy: well, yeah. But, but I'm saying is that like there was, but it's not by accident. Yeah. Yeah. It's not by accident. Just like getting a good life is not by accident as well.

[00:32:27] Yeah. You know? Um, now, like, you know, certain people in their current life, they could be born with either like, you know, poor genetics or like, um, poor health for example. They be passed down conditions. Like, um, yeah. I feel like for, for, for that, you obviously could make the best of out, out of like what's.

[00:32:47] Can what you're presented with. Well, you can, yeah. What you're presented with. 

[00:32:50] Eldar: And, and I, and I think that at the end of the day when it comes to politics, that's exactly what we're trying to do, right? Mm-hmm. Uh, you know, those people who feel like, oh, this is unfortunate, or whatever, or, you know, subjected to certain things they can say like, oh yeah, but that's not gonna allow me to do this.

[00:33:05] Okay, well that's a restriction that we have to work around. Like, we have to do our best. You know? And there's plenty of pro, you know, there's plenty of restrictions out there that hold us away from doing certain things. You know, you might be fucking passionate about basketball, but you were born five two, well, well you can't be an NBA player, for example, you know?

[00:33:23] Yeah. And that's just one example, you know, and politics might have certain restrictions that not gonna allow you to create a certain business that you want to create or whatever. You know? Like if you wanna like, I don't know. Fucking become a fisherman and fish only for whales, but whales are restricted animals or something like that, you know?

[00:33:37] Mm-hmm. Like, you can't do that because like the government said, it's like they're fucking Yeah. Endangered, endangered species, for example. Like, there's gonna be a lot of different things that might hold you away, but you do with what you can. Yeah. If you are born handicapped, for example, or whatever it is, you mm-hmm.

[00:33:51] You figure out the world that you, you can be most empowered in, and you kind of stick to that, and you're trying to be the best that you can until you reach the ceiling if there is a ceiling. 

[00:34:00] Toliy: Yeah. That and, and, and like in, in, in politics, like, I mean, I, I, I know the number 'cause I just heard it online there, there's like 8.5 million people in New York City.

[00:34:10] Mm-hmm. This person was voted for, right? Yes. There, there wasn't like a hostile like army takeover, take takeover, where just like, Hey, we're gonna put this guy in, and you have no choice. Yeah, yeah. Right. Yeah. You also have a choice whether you live in New York City Right. Or whether you don't live in New York City.

[00:34:25] Of course. Correct. You know, and Yeah. And this person was voted for, yeah. So like, clearly he, there's a due process, had a majority vote, which means that a lot of people were agreeing with what he was saying or agree with maybe like, what, what, like, what's going on? But yeah, now this person also has to perform and they have to do their duty, and they have to start like, fulfilling their promises.

[00:34:47] And if they don't, they're probably gonna get voted out. Yeah. The voted hours get hated on and like, you know, all all like that's gonna happen. So it's like. You also have to be respectful of people's wishes, you know? Yeah. If, if, if enough people voted and you live in that ar area choice. Oh, you by, by choice.

[00:35:05] You have to, 

[00:35:06] Eldar: you have to respect democracy. 

[00:35:07] Toliy: Yeah. You have to respect democracy. Yeah. Yeah. Like if you also don't agree with how things are going or like what the rules are of the land that you're in, then Yeah. Like you, you should move for, for, for example, right? Yeah. You should go somewhere else. Mm-hmm.

[00:35:21] Um, but, but everyone can talk. 

[00:35:23] Eldar: And the result is when you talk, you complain. It's ugly. 

[00:35:28] Mike: It is ugly, 

[00:35:29] Eldar: right? Yes. You have no power. You just complain, complain, argue, fight, become angry, right? Yeah. I mean, you, we know how the ugly face looks, right? Yeah. How the angry face looks. We know it. How the frustrated face looks.

[00:35:43] Mm-hmm. How fearful face looks. Yeah. These are all things that do not represent beauty. 

[00:35:47] Mike: Nope. 

[00:35:50] Eldar: Right. But if you're empowered, if you're confident, focus. Know, your know your way. Go towards it slowly and steadily. I think then you represent some, some order, you represent some, something greater than just, you know, 

[00:36:06] some of the things that these people are after.

[00:36:09] Yeah. You know? Yeah. Yeah. I think it's like, um, 

[00:36:17] Mike: in, in, not in the politics, but in the, uh, in, in the stuff we were talking about before that is that, um, educating yourself, whatever, wherever you can get the education, you know, um, to see what's actually going on. See things for what they are, see things 

[00:36:35] Eldar: for what they are.

[00:36:36] Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then move in accordance. 

[00:36:38] Mike: Yeah. 

[00:36:39] Toliy: Yes. Yeah. I've, I feel like there, there's like a funny, um, almost like pheno, an ongoing and like mankind, you know, where like you, like you just, you spoke about, um, educating yourself, you know, and like. Learning in where, wherever, kind of way. Right. And um, I feel like if every, if, if everybody knew for a fact that if you don't educate yourself properly or you don't make like an effort to like, learn things and like go about life in the proper way, you will s suffer.

[00:37:15] For example, the 

[00:37:15] Eldar: educated people do know this 

[00:37:17] Toliy: well. Well, no, but I'm saying is that like, it's, it's almost like, hey, fine, you could choose to do nothing. 

[00:37:23] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:37:23] Toliy: But you're gonna suffer no matter what. 

[00:37:25] Eldar: Yeah. Convince, whereas the people 

[00:37:27] Toliy: who, the where the people who are suffering. Yeah. I don't think that they like, oh, well, I mean, I, I know that they don't believe that.

[00:37:33] Yeah. Correct. Mm-hmm. But that's the reality is like, hey, you don't have to go about, don't go about live, like figuring out how to live a good life. Yeah. Don't do it, but you're gonna suffer regardless. Regardless. The consequence is 

[00:37:43] Eldar: a consequence. 

[00:37:43] Toliy: So if that is true. You might as well go do it. Right? Like Yeah.

[00:37:48] It's almost like common sense, right? 

[00:37:50] Eldar: Yeah, it is. But there's like some kind of order or some kind of a thing where like it's a, it's a law almost. Yeah. Like gravity law. 

[00:37:57] Toliy: No, I know. But if everybody was born into like this truth of like, Hey, this is what's gonna happen. Like, you have, you have a choice. Yeah.

[00:38:03] And whether you want to go learn and educate yourself and engage in things, that's up to you. But life is that, but life, but like, life is gonna hit you over the head. Yeah. Life is that. 

[00:38:14] Eldar: Mm-hmm. 

[00:38:14] Toliy: Right? No. YY no life is that. But I'm saying is that like the majority of people don't believe, don't, don't like Yeah.

[00:38:22] Know this for a fact because if they did, they'll do otherwise you, you would, you would obviously do otherwise. But people who don't do otherwise, they obviously don't believe that. And they're living in their, um, own ignorance. 

[00:38:36] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:38:36] Toliy: But, and they're suffering and they're just not like they are suffering.

[00:38:39] Now, if you told me that, like you could just escape it. You don't have to do all this work. You don't have to work on yourself. You don't have to do any of that. 

[00:38:46] Eldar: Yeah, 

[00:38:47] Toliy: fine. But that's not true. Yeah. There, there is no like, like he, like heavenly life or like good beautiful life that you could live and not do the work and not work on yourself and not do those kinds of things because you're just gonna be put in the worst position possible.

[00:39:05] And to me, the absolute worst position in life, the absolute worst, like I, I can't think of something worse, is, um, uh, if you're suffering and, and you have and, and you have no, no clue and no way of finding out how or why, if, if this is what you're experiencing, that's hell, that's crazy. Hell, you know, because it's like you're gonna, you're, you're suffering.

[00:39:29] You don't know what it's from. Like you may have some guesses or you're, but you're probably wrong about it. Yeah. Um, yeah. And you have no idea, but you're gonnas suffer. 

[00:39:38] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:39:38] Toliy: Like that to me is like the absolute worst. 

[00:39:42] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:39:43] Toliy: Now if you're suffering and you know why, or maybe you're trying to figure it out.

[00:39:48] Mm-hmm. Or you're on the path of trying to 

[00:39:50] Eldar: get educated, 

[00:39:50] Toliy: get educated, then that, that's already great. That, that to me is already a good life. Because then like you have direction, you know what you can do, you might have a choice, you know what's possible. Like Yeah. You have a chance. 

[00:40:02] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:40:02] Toliy: And then if you, if you stick with that long enough, I think you're guaranteed to, to succeed, guaranteed.

[00:40:08] Eldar: Mm-hmm. 

[00:40:08] Toliy: Um,

[00:40:12] Eldar: yeah. So beauty tie it all back. Is that what we're all 

[00:40:19] striving for? To live a beautiful, good life that's has order? 

[00:40:25] Toliy: Yeah. I feel like, um, because like, when it comes to like, like thinking, like actual thinking, um, I feel like at least for us, it wasn't just like you were born as like, just like you were born into this thinking and then like.

[00:40:40] You were from like, you know, square one, like living a particular way. Yeah. It's usually like a, uh, some kind of like, you know, 

[00:40:50] Eldar: like discovery process. 

[00:40:51] Toliy: Yeah. Yeah. Some kind of discovery. I don't process, I don't know, maybe like in your twenties or whenever, right? Mm-hmm. To like that, that like, things can be done differently and that, and then you try to, um, figure out like what, like what contracts of life did you already sign?

[00:41:06] Yeah. And figure out how you can unsign them. Yeah. Re renegotiate. Renegotiate them. Yeah. Yeah. Renegotiate all those, like, like leases you have, you know mm-hmm. Of like the different things that you signed up for. 

[00:41:16] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:41:17] Toliy: And like, that whole process is obviously very hard and takes a lot of time. Um, so, um, yeah, like if we were just born into it then, then I feel like you, it would be very different, but because you're like.

[00:41:35] You try to discover how to think like the discovery of thinking and pro and proper thinking. It's like when we discovered it, half our life lived was already like, like, like the current life that we've lived, half of it was already lived pretty much, right? Yeah. Yeah. Like if you were, let's say 25, well, like, or, or, or even more actually.

[00:41:56] 'cause like if you're 25 for example, and you discover you've been alive for let's say like 24 point whatever amount of years mm-hmm. Doing things particular ways and then you discover something, well like odds are still against you at that point obviously. 'cause you've been doing things a particular way.

[00:42:13] You've got habits, but Yeah, you have habits, you have understandings. Yeah. You know, and a lot of those understandings that you make at a young age, um, have a really large impact on, on, on you for a long time. And changing them is always like way harder than like. Keeping them as they are, that that whole process is very, um, do you, um, intense, 

[00:42:37] Mike: is this like a matter of evolution?

[00:42:40] Like I just had that question, like 

[00:42:41] Eldar: mm-hmm. 

[00:42:42] Mike: There are people evolving at different speeds. Yeah, I think 

[00:42:45] Eldar: so. I guess that's exactly what's happening. I think that the order and of all is just like, everything is exactly where it's supposed to be. Yeah. I, I agree. Like there's a fucking order. Yeah. There's life's order.

[00:42:56] There is, yeah. It's a law. 

[00:42:57] Mike: Yeah. We, we, we speak about this all the time. All the time, and like there's no way around it. There's no way around it. But we can't like, pinpoint like, it's not a thing that you can control. It's like we're trying 

[00:43:07] Eldar: to interpret it. Yeah. So we then can apply ourselves in accordance 

[00:43:11] mm-hmm.

[00:43:11] To the, the beautiful structure that it is. Right. Yeah. Because it is beautiful. Mm-hmm. 

[00:43:16] You know 

[00:43:16] what I mean? And there's a lot to be gotten, a lot to be discovered, a lot to, to learn. There's so much. And when you align yourself within that structure properly, it feels good. You know, and in turn you fucking feel beautiful.

[00:43:28] You feel good, and then you develop that aura, you know? So, yeah, absolutely. 

[00:43:35] Mike: Yeah. 

[00:43:36] Toliy: Yeah. Like 

[00:43:37] Eldar: the, 

[00:43:37] Mike: the person, does that support the theory of reincarnation even more? Or what does it support? It has to like the evolution thing. It has to, 

[00:43:46] Eldar: yeah. 

[00:43:47] Mm-hmm. 

[00:43:49] Yeah. I don't think you just fucking turn off and you're done.

[00:43:51] Like, like, yeah. What, what is that? You know what I mean? Socrates believe in the mortality of the assault. Yeah. Yeah. Go ahead. To, 

[00:43:59] Toliy: uh, um, no, I was just gonna say that, um, um, like the process of trying to figure out like, uh, like the, the, um, the person with like the, uh, heavy like suffering and like chaotic life, they don't like if, if it was just like chance or something like that, um.

[00:44:19] They can't understand how someone who lives life good, like what they actually do and how they actually go about things. Yeah. Like to them it's like a completely foreign 

[00:44:26] Eldar: correct. 

[00:44:27] Toliy: Laying language. That's what I just said. Like even like they're trying to figure out 

[00:44:29] Eldar: Yes. Your process, if somebody looked at it, they're like, what's the magic sauce?

[00:44:33] They not gonna be able to interpret that which is happening 

[00:44:37] in front of them. 

[00:44:37] So they will be mesmerized by the outcome. 

[00:44:40] Mm-hmm. 

[00:44:42] Correct. 

[00:44:43] Well, yeah, they're gonna be, oh, the thing is, 

[00:44:45] it would be, that looks good. Yeah. I like it. I, I want it. But they most likely won't be able to get it. 

[00:44:53] Mike: Well, yeah, because everybody's evolving at different things at different times in different stages.

[00:44:57] Like Yeah. He evolved from the anxiety behavior. Yeah. And now he doesn't have to carry that, so now he has more freedom for free time to focus on something else he wants. Yeah. You know, or whatever things that he evolved out of on top of the anxiety. Yeah. You know? 

[00:45:16] Toliy: Yeah. Yeah. Like the, the, uh. Um,

[00:45:22] you can't just like apply life learnings on somebody else, even though, you know, from my fir from my own 

[00:45:28] Eldar: experience, from 

[00:45:29] Toliy: my own experience, I've wanted to, for a long time to, to many data for people. 

[00:45:33] Eldar: Yeah, yeah. 

[00:45:33] Toliy: To have them like, skip the process of learning and going through something to just being able to do, do things like a better way.

[00:45:42] Yeah. But like those people at those times, they're, they're blind to those kinds of things. They're blind to those details. They're blind to those, um, under understandings and they can't see what you see. Like, they can't understand what you understand. Um, the only thing I think that you can like actually help them do is like those who raise their hand and those who want to, you know, start to question or try to figure out better ways.

[00:46:10] Yeah. Question them. Yeah. Yeah. You can be there to. To question them. And then, and then if they have the, their own and like, if they have enough of their own reasons and willpower and like desires to figure this stuff out, then um, you can help them in that process. 

[00:46:27] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:46:28] Toliy: But obviously like people have to raise their hand and they have to be 

[00:46:32] Eldar: like,

[00:46:37] yeah. Like they, they, they, they have to have, 

[00:46:39] Toliy: um, resiliency and desire. Like 'cause 

[00:46:43] Eldar: to 

[00:46:43] Toliy: fight. Yeah, yeah. To fight. Yeah. Because, because it's, it, it, it's difficult when you don't have like a, um, like a tangible like, um, outcome that you can just like sign up for. Because a lot of these like things that like enable you to have a good life.

[00:47:07] They're not tan. They're, they're, they're, they're not like. So the person that doesn't have them, they're not just like tangible things like, hey, put in like this amount of hours. Like yeah, this is what you get in return and it's like a physical item. 

[00:47:19] Eldar: Mm-hmm. 

[00:47:20] Toliy: You are, um, clawing like, to, like, you're, you're like clawing for things that like, I guess like don't like exist, but they do exist, obviously.

[00:47:29] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:47:30] Toliy: You know, and that's a, a difficult thing for, I think for people to sign up for is like, for, for that much like suffering and that much like, uh, down and that much like pain and to do that, all that, but continue like coming back to learn more and to keep, keep trying. Yeah. I just feel like it's like, uh, it's overwhelming.

[00:47:51] Eldar: Yeah. But necessary. 

[00:47:55] Toliy: But necessary. Yeah. If I, again, like if, if you could just believe that as a truth that like, hey, don't do it. Mm-hmm. You're gonna suffer. 

[00:48:07] Eldar: Yeah, 

[00:48:08] Toliy: for sure. It's like, no question about that. So like, you ultimately don't even need to figure anything out. You just need to figure out that, 

[00:48:17] Eldar: just that one piece.

[00:48:18] Toliy: Yeah. 

[00:48:19] Eldar: Because the difference, the contrast. The contrast. 

[00:48:21] Toliy: Well, yeah, just, just that like, because if you don't believe that you're going like if, uh, if, if you don't believe that, if you don't think that like that, that's act actually real. They didn't think Yeah. Like you can run amuck and you can just go about life and do, do whatever, do whatever, and there's no consequences to anything.

[00:48:39] Yeah. But if you, but if you actually believe that no life, you could be under that impression. But there's consequences. Yes. If you actually believe consciously that like life is consequential, right? Yeah. Where like there is consequences to your actions. Yeah. And there is an order of things. Yeah. A violate them wrong.

[00:48:59] Yeah. And if you don't, and, and if you live a, a life of violating those things Yeah. Then 

[00:49:04] Eldar: pain is inevitable. 

[00:49:05] Toliy: Yeah. 

[00:49:05] Eldar: And, and then why not? 

[00:49:07] Toliy: Why, why would you not pursue those, those things? Yeah. Like why would you not? There, there, there's nothing more important than, than, than that. 

[00:49:14] Eldar: You said that again, last, last, last podcast.

[00:49:16] You said that in this podcast you're saying the same thing. The most important thing is self-examination again. 

[00:49:23] Mike: Yeah. I just, uh, saw a quote couple days ago, Uhhuh, and, uh, I just thought about it now. Like, I guess it's kind of tied into what we're talking about. Mm-hmm. And it's, um, I don't know why, uh, but the quote is, I cannot teach anybody anything.

[00:49:41] I can only make them think. 

[00:49:43] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:49:44] Mike: You heard this one before. 

[00:49:45] Eldar: Yeah. I did hear this one before. Yeah. Yeah. I told you heard this one, philosophers. Yeah. Mm-hmm. 

[00:49:48] Mike: It's from your boy, so 

[00:49:49] Eldar: Yeah. From, 

[00:49:50] Mike: so I don't know that, but I heard it and I was like, yeah, it's, it is interesting. 

[00:49:52] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:49:53] Mike: He said that obviously. Yeah. You know, his, he definitely was making people think.

[00:49:58] Yeah. You know? 

[00:49:58] Eldar: Yeah. Through questioning, again, through challenging and questioning, you know, uh, their understanding of the world. Yeah. Because he was under the impression that they were under the wrong impression. 

[00:50:10] Mm-hmm. 

[00:50:11] You know? Yeah. And he obviously proved that because, uh, a lot of times they were not able to structure things beautifully.

[00:50:18] Mm-hmm. 

[00:50:18] Right. It was always a 

[00:50:19] mess. Yeah.

[00:50:24] Yeah. Interesting. 

[00:50:27] Mike: Yeah, I thought that 

[00:50:27] Eldar: was interesting. Um, 

[00:50:29] Mike: for sure, because I think a lot of times we talk, we'd like to like, pass along the information Yeah. You know, share what we, uh, um, thought, think about, or we might, you know, understand a little bit about, but yeah. It's also interesting that idea, like mm-hmm.

[00:50:46] You can make people think for sure. I mean, by asking questions. Yeah. Thought provoking questions that'll really, you know Yeah. Might get their juices going. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Yeah. It's definitely 

[00:50:57] Eldar: interesting. But So what do you got on Beauty Mike? Beauty 

[00:51:06] Mike: simple. Yeah. It's the, or to me. Like I, this is like a weird thing.

[00:51:11] I don't know how to explain it. I, I don't make, like, for me it's,

[00:51:17] uh, it makes sense, but I guess maybe it doesn't make sense to somebody else. In my head it makes sense. Like there's only two things that exist out there. Mm-hmm. Right? There's beauty or not beauty. 

[00:51:26] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:51:27] Mike: Right. And then I think that applies for everything, like mm-hmm. Patient or not patient, right? Yeah.

[00:51:31] There's nothing else. Mm-hmm. I think in order to be beautiful and to be patient Yeah. And within it, you have to carry all the great qualities. Mm-hmm. All the virtues. And I think, um, to use those words in the true essence, right? Yeah. Like beauty, can you be beautiful, but not, not patient, not kind, not just, yeah.

[00:51:50] Not respectful. That's a good point. Not loving. Yeah. Probably not. Like how, how would it ever work? Yeah. I feel like those words, they're just words. Yeah. But they're something else behind them because they really like. Like just two words, any two words you pick, they'll represent like a unlimited amount of knowledge and wisdom that they carry within it.

[00:52:10] Yeah. And it's like, um, it, it is very interesting, like how that, that I guess makes sense in my head, but, but yeah. Ultimately, you know, you're never gonna, you, you're not going get to true beauty a beautiful result. Yeah. Oh, a big, beautiful Bill. 

[00:52:31] Eldar: A big beautiful plan, which we lined out for a, a big, beautiful friend.

[00:52:35] Yeah. Are you guys ready to take on that journey? Sorry, I'm gonna cut you off for sure. 

[00:52:42] Mike: For sure. But now, now that we, did you make him make him beautiful or what? I think we can, but now the question I had just after all this, all this thing is like Uhhuh, is he in the point of his evolutionary process?

[00:52:54] Yeah. That he's ready to evolve, you know? Yeah. Like. 

[00:53:00] Eldar: Totally said, we have to ask that question. Right. Life has to ask you the question when you're finally born, like, yo, there's this way or this that way. Mm-hmm. You know, the ignorant way. It's gonna hurt a lot. Yeah. Do you want this or not learning much better, but as if we, I think we came to this point where we finally like, yo, we given him that question.

[00:53:16] Yeah. Which you want, 

[00:53:19] Mike: you know, as if we determin to some degree. I think it is. Yeah. Because 

[00:53:25] Eldar: like, but did we shake enough, did we give him that warning? Right. And if you wondering who we're talking about, we're talking about Harris, the fu, uh, future president of 2050 that we're trying to help and raise a tumble into.

[00:53:39] Yeah. Big, beautiful rock. You know, um, does he see it? Does he feel it? Right. Those are the questions. Yeah. To see whether or not do, do you actually wanna learn? Do you actually wanna avoid pain? Yeah. American people's futures are, uh, yeah. Not American, the whole world. Yeah. Because I'm not gonna, I'm not sure if anybody else, we never had a, a candidate.

[00:54:03] No, this is, was this was a candidate. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, I was excited for the journey for sure. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, I still am. 

[00:54:09] Mike: Yeah. Andre was grilling me for like half an hour, 45 minutes. That's why the whole politics came about. Ah. He's like, tell me more about this thing. You know, this harvesting, I don't want tell him too much.

[00:54:18] Yeah. You know? Um, yeah. But I, and that's how the whole politic thing came about. He is like, so what is this guy's qualities? What is he good at? What does he know? It's it's told him we're building it from the ground up. He's like, yeah, but he is 27. He is tall. I'm like, yeah. But he has a whole team around him.

[00:54:35] Yeah, of course. You know, plus it's gonna take 25 years to told him. Right? Yeah. I told him. Yeah. He knows. Well, now it's 24. Now it's 24. Yeah. So it was, but we've, 

[00:54:41] Eldar: yeah, we've been chiseling away. No. Well, we came to a point where like we hit something. We hit a big, we had a big, beautiful rock. Yes, we did hit something.

[00:54:50] A boulder. Yes. We hit something. Not a little pebble, you know, and now we are the crossroads. Yeah. 

[00:54:56] Toliy: Right now there's a testing of foundation. 

[00:54:58] Eldar: Yeah. We're testing. Yeah. Does he have it in him? Is there, you know, can we tap it into this hole, you know? Or is there too much ego? Or is there too much pride and arrogance that still needs to do what?

[00:55:14] Evolve. No. 

[00:55:15] Mike: Well, to me the evolution is the question. Know keep. Yeah. To keep getting hurt. Yeah. Yeah. The evolution to evolve. Yeah. To me it's like dial the question. I understand. Uh, yeah. Like I don't know any much about evolution in the scientific sense. Yeah. But my understanding is those iguanas Yeah.

[00:55:30] That were in the water first, then they became land. In the land. In 

[00:55:32] Eldar: the land. Oh, the Gala Galapagos. The Galapagos, yeah. They were in land. Yes. And then they became water because they needed to go eat the algae off the, off the bottom of the 

[00:55:40] Mike: right. 

[00:55:41] Eldar: The sea. 

[00:55:41] Mike: The, is he, uh, is he the lizard? Is he getting on the land or no?

[00:55:45] Is he getting on the land or not? Right. Is he staying on the land or he is going on the water? 

[00:55:48] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:55:49] Mike: Yeah. And I think, I mean, it's interesting how that all came about, how that process worked, where they actually evolved and they adapted to this completely different environment. They had 

[00:55:59] Eldar: to, 

[00:55:59] Mike: they were at a point where they were not gonna go, uh, yeah.

[00:56:05] Once you're, either you're in 

[00:56:06] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:56:07] Mike: Or you're out. Yeah. You can't be like, actually I went in the water. I don't like it in here. Yeah. I stood for six months, but I'm just gonna come back to land. Yeah. I think if you're in the land, you're in the land. That's it. Yeah. You die. Yeah. On the land. Yeah. You don't survive 'cause you don't have, or you go in the water and you live in the water.

[00:56:20] Yeah. So like, that's interesting. Yeah. I think that's kind of where the crossroads as well. Yeah. Of the evolution I think it is. Yeah. Of the evolution. 

[00:56:33] Eldar: Yeah. And I, I think that it's important for the person to make the choice, right. Because they have to live with it obviously. 

[00:56:38] Yeah. 

[00:56:38] It's not for us to try to like oversell it, you know?

[00:56:41] Mm-hmm. 

[00:56:42] And, uh, shove it down anyone's throat. No. But like, if you want to, if you don't wanna better yourself, then No. You know? Yeah. You don't have to follow this big beautiful plan. 

[00:56:50] Yeah. 

[00:56:50] You know? Yeah. 

[00:56:51] Toliy: Yeah. I feel like for those kinds of good things in life, then like it, um, it never works where you have a clear like, uh, reward.

[00:57:02] Where you're just like making a clear trade. Yeah. Like time for like reward, for example. Yeah. Like if I do this and I'm going to get this. Yeah. Like, this is what's gonna happen. 

[00:57:11] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:57:12] Toliy: It like, it's usually you requiring you to put yourself in a very vulnerable like state 

[00:57:18] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:57:19] Toliy: And to like, she all that nonsense.

[00:57:21] Yeah. Shut that nonsense. Which like to be compatible with the good stuff. Yes. Yeah. But like, it, it can't feel like, um, like, you do this and get, you get this, I get this. Yeah. Yeah. You're supposed to almost feel like it, it's like a weird thing where you're feel like you're like, um, I don't wanna say like taking a chance, but it's almost blindly like you're Yeah.

[00:57:46] Like you're kind of like, um, jumping 

[00:57:48] Eldar: into the pool, not knowing what's underneath there. 

[00:57:51] Toliy: Yeah. You're, you're, you're like, um, you're willing to put yourself, you're, you're like choosing to put yourself into a, a, uh, vulnerable state. To then get things in life in return, but you never know that you get it.

[00:58:05] Yeah. Yeah. It's almost like you, you kind of give everything for nothing. It is it, it is, it is kind of how, like the, like it could be perceived as, but you get everything. You get everything. 

[00:58:18] Eldar: It's a crazy paradox. Mm-hmm. You know? That's a crazy paradox, the way it's structured. Yeah. 

[00:58:23] Toliy: You 

[00:58:23] Eldar: know, it has to be like that.

[00:58:26] You know why? Because otherwise ego, ego would be fucking tricking everything and trying to get everything. 

[00:58:33] Mike: Well, I think Yeah. It's like the, you have to shed the skin. You have to, you have to shed the skin. But even though it's scary. Yeah. You don't know what's gonna happen if you shed it. But you have to.

[00:58:41] Eldar: Yeah. 

[00:58:42] Mike: Otherwise you don't, again, you don't progress, you don't evolve. You don't Yeah. Become better. You don't. 

[00:58:47] Eldar: Yeah. 'cause then you could just manipulate, you try to manipulate your way in trying to get some stuff right. Yeah. But it's never enough. 

[00:58:53] Toliy: Yeah. The, no, the thing is that for like a, um, a. Naturally, um, um, suffering person operates on like the currency of, you know, like items or things, or like, yeah, like they're more understanding of that like, right, like they're, they're more understanding that which, which, which is also why like this discipline is a very, like, familiar like language.

[00:59:15] Because, because like you can't apply discipline to get things that don't exist in, in like a physical form, 

[00:59:23] Eldar: right? 

[00:59:24] Toliy: Mm-hmm. Like, you, you would never say like, Hey, I'm gonna apply discipline to learn how to be more like respectful, kind. You know? Kind like that doesn't happen, right? No. You apply discipline to get something.

[00:59:34] To get something. Yeah. That's, that, that's the whole point of it. You do something that you don't want to do or don't like to do, thinking that you're going to get something in return. Return in return. Yeah. That, that's the only reason anybody would ever make a, uh, trade off, right? That 

[00:59:47] Eldar: kind of trade off.

[00:59:48] Yeah. 

[00:59:48] Toliy: Why would you do something that you don't wanna do? Only if you get something that you feel like you will do, you're gonna get Yeah. 

[00:59:53] Mike: Even when you get that thing, you actually realize you don't really want it. 

[00:59:56] Toliy: Yeah. 

[00:59:56] Mike: Well, that's the discipline. Yeah. 

[00:59:58] Toliy: Yeah. You 

[00:59:58] Mike: don't really need it. 

[00:59:59] Toliy: Yeah. But it's a more black and white, like a language.

[01:00:03] Um, where I feel like in this kind of stuff, um, yeah, you won't, you like, you'll, it, it, it just like, like the um, like if I could visualize it in like a story 

[01:00:15] Eldar: mm-hmm. 

[01:00:16] Toliy: It's almost like you have to give away. Like you have to give your most valuable things for what you think is a box of nothing. 

[01:00:25] Eldar: Yeah. 

[01:00:25] Toliy: But that box has like the most treasure period.

[01:00:29] But the truth is what 

[01:00:29] Eldar: you're giving away is the least valuable. Is the least valuable. But you feel, feel and in the box Yeah. Which is invisible. It's, and the box is empty. Okay. And you like, you see the box, what's inside of it. Mm-hmm. It's empty. But the truth is like when you close it and you actually get it, stuff just appears in it.

[01:00:46] But you have to do the trade off. 

[01:00:48] Toliy: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's like a trick. Yeah. Yeah. If you wanna just like Yeah. Make, make it into like a meme. It's like, you're like, would you trade a million dollars for nothing? Yeah. Yeah. Most people would say no. Yeah, of course. But it's everything. Mm-hmm. But it's everything.

[01:01:04] But that, that's how it feel like to to, to me, that that's how that moment feels like. It's like, are you willing to give this all up? 

[01:01:14] Eldar: So let me ask you this question, and I usually don't like to make the statement, can philosophy be promoted? 

[01:01:25] Like actually promoted, like successfully? 

[01:01:29] Mike: Well, that's why I read that quote.

[01:01:31] 'cause that's, that made me think like, can you teach somebody anything? Like can you teach them philosophy and whatever it is that can you teach them and truly to, yeah. 'cause 'cause the fact of ownership. 

[01:01:43] Eldar: Yeah. 

[01:01:44] Mike: Regardless, right. Is ownership required? When you make that person think mm-hmm. They, they take a lot of ownership when they stumble upon something, right?

[01:01:52] Mm-hmm. Versus when you tell them like, Hey, yeah, just go do this or go do that. Yeah. They don't, they don't, it's different. It's different. You know, it's, it's not their own. 

[01:02:01] Eldar: Yeah. 

[01:02:01] Mike: They're like, uh, they're like, I guess with our, uh, with our friend Phil. 

[01:02:07] Eldar: Mm-hmm. 

[01:02:08] Mike: Or this was like a Broadway show here and he was just play in his part, but once the show was over, 

[01:02:12] Eldar: yeah.

[01:02:13] Mike: He left the part even though he played the part very well. Right. Yeah. In a way. Yeah. So you just adapt to the environment you have to be in. And I guess kind of schools like that. Like for most people, you just come in there, you not really interested, but you kind of gotta adapt and like, you know, to get grades to pass to graduate, you know?

[01:02:30] Yeah. You adapt and then afterwards, like you don't care about the shit. You forget about it and you just move on with whatever. Like, you never think about this shit. 

[01:02:37] Eldar: Yeah. So that is interesting. I. 

[01:02:41] Mike: I don't know. Is it adaptation here that's at play? People, that's a good, that's a good question. People who are just like, 

[01:02:47] Eldar: you know, playing the part.

[01:02:48] Yeah. Like, like you have to do this kind of thing. Like, you know, Harrison necessarily wants to do podcasts on Friday night. Like, 

[01:02:54] Mike: no. 

[01:02:55] Eldar: You know what I mean? It's like, oh, it's part of the gig. Like, they do it. So like, I feel bad if I don't do it. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? He's 

[01:03:00] Mike: adapting for whatever reasons he, in his head, you know, concluded.

[01:03:05] Yes. Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Can you 

[01:03:12] Toliy: Yeah. Like this, this question to me that he's like, uh, tasked with right, right now is the question is do you know, or do you not know? 

[01:03:20] Eldar: Yeah, I know, I 

[01:03:23] Mike: know what you're saying. Yeah. You know, but, but how is that possible if a person who knew there wouldn't be a question?

[01:03:29] Toliy: Well, that's the thing, is that there, there's opportunities I feel like, in life and mm-hmm. There's opportunities for, um, for humbling. There's opportunity, like there, there's sometimes where you stumble and you don't know what you're, um, like what, what, what you're signed up for maybe, or like what, what you're saying.

[01:03:49] Mm-hmm. So you get challenged with the question like, do you know or do you not not know? And if you say that, you know, then there's no learning. There's no like, then yeah. Then like you go on what, what, what, what? You know, you said that, you know, so show it, show, show what you know, and usually show what you know.

[01:04:07] Or when you get challenged in that kind of way, you say, like, you, you have still like the ability to be like, yeah, you, you know what, like, you're right. Like, I don't really know, like, um, I'd like to learn. I, I, I'd like to find out more about it because maybe, maybe, I don't know. And I'd like to find out. 

[01:04:26] Eldar: Mm.

[01:04:27] Toliy: I I feel like those opportunities are given at particular times. 

[01:04:31] Eldar: Yeah. I think there's timing to it too. There's, yeah. I think you're right. 

[01:04:35] Toliy: Yeah. 

[01:04:35] Eldar: Yeah. You know. But you know, there's one, one thing though too, and don't discount it, is that the fact that he came to us, you know what I'm saying? That's a, I think it's a big thing too.

[01:04:47] Or like, why us, you know what I'm saying? Is it just like a mere chance of like, oh, I know him. We need a job. Like one of those things? Or is it something bigger? You know what I mean? Yeah. Those 

[01:04:58] Mike: questions 

[01:04:59] Eldar: are, you know, because like to stumble upon at least our type of group, like it's very specific, you know what I mean?

[01:05:05] And I think this group has been specific for a very long time. Yeah. So this is not like a random person stumbling upon it because like we have a track record already. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's very specific. Yeah. But so to come back willingly and volunteer with your hand up to start getting bombarded with very specific questions very early, it's a, you know, like, that makes me wonder, you know, that might be that like, we did not apply the force, 

[01:05:33] Mike: but that, that might be like a.

[01:05:36] Life's, uh, roadmap that he has, you know, or anybody has. Yeah. And again, like we are also like, yeah. We're also with the popcorn in other people's lives. We kind of Yes. Don't know what the next scene in the movie entails, who, who's 

[01:05:48] Eldar: the main character and whose story. 

[01:05:50] Mike: Yeah, that's right. So I think, and I think that's, uh, that's kind of how it is.

[01:05:57] Yeah. A lot of stuff we don't, we, we really don't know. We don't know what's his, like Yeah. What's his trajectory or path? What he, what has he earned or what has, does he deserve Yeah. Life to give him in, in this point, in his cross order, in his life. Yeah. Yeah. You know, has he done enough good, if you want to call it that.

[01:06:13] Yeah. To then to progress to the next stage. Yeah. He is a crazy center. Yeah. And he, he came here. Yeah. And he suffer even more to suffer even more, 

[01:06:22] Eldar: you know, that's a good question too. That's a good question. 

[01:06:26] Toliy: Yeah. I was just thinking, it seems like, I mean, this is like a lifelong debate whether there, there, there is or isn't, but it seems like.

[01:06:34] The, the goal of life is to get free will. 

[01:06:37] Eldar: Right? Yeah. I think that the goal, but yeah. Where you have the choice in the matter where you actually are making choices in such a way where you have the difference between right and all. Yeah. But yeah. But 

[01:06:48] Toliy: it sound, it's, it sounds like that, that, that question is there free will or is there not free will.

[01:06:53] So it like, it sounds like there, there is free will, but only if you have the ability to think. 

[01:07:00] Eldar: Yeah. 

[01:07:00] Toliy: You know? Mm-hmm. And if you don't have the ability to think, then there is no free will. 

[01:07:05] Mike: But when you get to the free will, then do you need to no longer think 

[01:07:11] Toliy: Well, no. No, because like, like you can only, you can only, you only have free will when, when you do think, when you can actually, when you actually learn how to think properly and do things properly mm-hmm.

[01:07:24] Is when you actually have free will. Everything before that is just like a predetermined fate. Two thirds is genetics. 

[01:07:31] Eldar: Mm is true. Dr. Dre, 

[01:07:33] for us. This is true. Yeah. You know, the one third is you can manipulate. I think that's where the free will probably lives, but yeah, like a lot of shit is predetermined.

[01:07:41] Like a lot of shit probably is predetermined for you. Yeah. It's based on who you are. That's the thing. Based on the attachments that you are holding, the impressions that you are under. Yeah. All that shit is like, that's like you can fucking do a fortune telling shit for some people its obvious. 

[01:07:54] Toliy: Yeah. But that's also the, the funny thing is that like, if it's true, if, if, if, if we're in agreement, if, if we are that free will happens only when you have the ability to think.

[01:08:03] It sounds like most people don't get free will because they don't have the ability to to to have it pretty much Right. Predeterminism it. Like if, if, if we can call it that right? Is required for people that can't think 

[01:08:19] Eldar: full predeterminism. Like where you don't have like no choice in the matter whatsoever.

[01:08:23] It's probably like the ultimate Hell 

[01:08:24] Toliy: yeah. Like that. But that's, but that's required for people that can, can think. Right. Some people 

[01:08:28] Mike: are like in Limbos, probably 

[01:08:30] Toliy: between the two. If you can't think, then you, you, you need predetermined outcomes. 

[01:08:33] Mike: Yeah. To, 

[01:08:33] Toliy: to just like, yeah. You just guide, kinda to guide you.

[01:08:36] Yeah. You just kind of part of the, you need something to guide you, not you not, not you to guide yourself. Yeah. You know? Yeah. So, yeah. I feel like, um, and in life 

[01:08:47] Eldar: we have all that stuff, right? You can do Right. And you can be, you know, try to make as many choices as you want. Kinda like, you know, to your own faculties to have the ability to have money, maybe travel and do all this other stuff that maybe costs money or whatever, you know, or you could go to jail, they're gonna tell you what to do, when to sleep, when to shit.

[01:09:05] Mm-hmm. You know what I mean? Or, you know, be subjected to a very specific thing. Um. You can make wrong choices in the beginning, and then you have the responsibilities of feeding your kids to have a nine to five job or more. Yeah. 

[01:09:17] Toliy: All these things sound like people are, are like, when you're trying to figure out what to do in life, right?

[01:09:22] Like the, uh, it, it like, it's almost like the way that the system is currently construct it, is that like it's making you, uh, make a decision on what your pre predetermined life is gonna be. Are you gonna have kids super early and have no, like financial abilities or like that Yeah. Freedom. Then, then you're probably in for struggle.

[01:09:40] Correct. Right. Predetermined. Yeah. Predetermined. Right. Unless you win the lot, you're lucky. Are you gonna be, let's just say like, I don't know, you go for like accounting and you like, you know, there's an accountant's like schedule, like it's a predetermined kind of like thing. 

[01:09:54] Eldar: Yeah. 

[01:09:54] Toliy: You're gonna go for something more entrepreneurial, for example.

[01:09:57] Yeah. That's 

[01:09:57] Eldar: more free flowing. 

[01:09:58] Toliy: Yeah. More free flowing, but have a, a lot of predetermined, um, struggles, right? Yeah. Particular things. Yeah. Are you going to attach yourself to like, crazy amounts of money, right? Yeah. That's also a predetermined like, uh, thing, lifestyle, right? Yeah. Yeah. So it's almost like everyone is choosing all these different professions and different things to go on to basically have this predetermined outcome pretty much, right.

[01:10:19] It's not like, 

[01:10:20] Eldar: yeah. 

[01:10:20] Toliy: If you choose, I dunno, to join a gang, right? Yeah. Gangs do particular things 

[01:10:24] Eldar: before you and after you, most likely, you're not gonna be sitting at the CEO's table in New York City making decisions on this. Right. You're gonna be fucking probably in jail or, or dead. 

[01:10:34] Toliy: Yeah. Those are their predetermined.

[01:10:35] Yeah. Then you become like structure based on what choices you make. Yeah. You then become like a statistic, right? Yeah. They already have statistics. If you do this, if you do this, this is, you're more likely to do that. Yeah. Like they, this is just statistics. If you participating in gangs or you sell drugs or you do this, yeah.

[01:10:50] You know this, if you're born in this area, you have this amount of kids. Yeah. Your kids are probably gonna be subject to this, right? Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. It's like, um, it pretty crazy. You honestly don't wanna predetermine life. It's wanna be able to think. It's pretty crazy that, unless. 

[01:11:09] Eldar: Your life is filled with virtuous val values virtues, right.

[01:11:14] Where you have a belief system that is good, then what happens? Right? What s also say that you have no choice in the matter to be wrong. Yeah. Yeah. Anymore that, 

[01:11:24] Mike: that's what I was trying to 

[01:11:25] Eldar: get to ask. Yeah. I was 

[01:11:26] Mike: trying to ask when you finally Yeah. Gets other side. 

[01:11:29] Eldar: Yeah. 

[01:11:30] Mike: You don't, you don't have free will anymore because you don't have a choice in the matter.

[01:11:34] Yeah. 'cause you're doing the right thing. 

[01:11:35] Eldar: Because that is also predetermined. But is that 

[01:11:37] Mike: like in enlightenment 

[01:11:38] Eldar: to some degree probably it is. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's already, now it's conditioned to do good and provides you with happiness. 

[01:11:46] Mm. 

[01:11:46] And serve you versus not. 

[01:11:48] Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

[01:11:49] Versus teach you and give you pain.

[01:11:52] Mike: I just thought about like, uh, you guys talking about like the gangs and the, and then Yeah. The different, like, I guess people doing different things in lives. Yeah. There's a war going on right now. Two countries are fighting. Yeah. And it's not just two countries, it's millions of people Yeah. That are fighting, dying.

[01:12:08] Yeah. In 2025. Yes. You know, this is pretty wild. We're over here talking about beauty. Yeah. You know? Yes. And there's still people and people 

[01:12:18] Eldar: that are very close to us. 

[01:12:19] Mike: Yeah. And people like to our culture. Yeah. I mean, fucking totally a Ukrainian bro, you know? Totally. The ops. Yeah. You 

[01:12:25] Eldar: know, 

[01:12:26] Mike: like Yeah. You know, and this is still happening.

[01:12:28] That goes to show like there's such a disparity in the world Correct. Of what's going on and the, the evolution of it. Yeah. But 

[01:12:34] Eldar: thank God the world is so big. Right. It's crazy. Yeah. That is like, you know, at least we're not bumping. 

[01:12:40] Mike: Yeah. And the thing is the people Yeah. Who are, not everybody, maybe some people.

[01:12:44] Yeah. But there's people, they're just as convinced about their, what we might be convinced about. Yeah. About their belief and the importance of what's going on. What's going on Yeah. And all that stuff. So it's two cra it's like two ideologies. Yeah. Completely different sides. Yeah. To understandings clash, but they're coexisting at the same time.

[01:13:01] Yeah. And that goes, I guess, it, it makes you really think like, damn, the world is so vast, there's so much going on and everybody's in a different Yeah. Fighting for different things, I guess. Yeah. If you want to call it that. 

[01:13:11] Eldar: I mean, yeah. You just travel the world. Right. And then the cultures is like, you, you go and you have this culture shock.

[01:13:16] Like, you live like this. Mm-hmm. You walk around barefoot, you eat with your hands. 

[01:13:20] Mike: Yeah. 

[01:13:21] Eldar: You know, as you can see that there's different understandings. Different, 

[01:13:23] Mike: yeah. 

[01:13:24] Eldar: Yeah. And beyond that, right. Different value systems. Yeah. Beliefs and stuff like that. Oh yeah. But religion. 

[01:13:30] Toliy: But, but, but that's also, I feel like the, the things that like we're after, like they, um, they, uh, transcend wherever you are.

[01:13:40] Like the world doesn't matter. Yeah. Right. 'cause those, those, those things about like the virtues, like Yeah. Those things about kindness, compassion, respect, like all it's universal, all those things. Language doesn't matter where you are in the world. Yeah. They're understood. You know, and like, they're, well, you hope so, because I think, well, no, like in 

[01:13:56] Eldar: war right now, I don't know if how much it's gonna be understood if you came there, you know, trying to preach kindness and shit, you know?

[01:14:02] Toliy: Well, yeah, yeah. No, no, no. Then, then, then, let me rephrase that. Like, you can benefit from it no matter where you are potentially. Yeah. Like, you have that you, you have the ability to bring that wherever you are for yourself and maybe, maybe for, for for others around you. 

[01:14:15] Eldar: Yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah. If you own one side, for example, of the war, and you with those people, you bring kindness.

[01:14:21] Yes. Those people might be very receptive to it, but go try to be kind to the other side right now because they hate you, you know? Mm-hmm. Not, not gonna, yeah. So, yeah. Alright. What are the final thoughts then on beauty? Is that the, is that it, is that the process. Follow the process, follow the truth, apply it upon yourself, and then naturally you start going towards becoming more beautiful and your life becomes more beautiful, much more orderly and desirable for yourself.

[01:14:50] Mm-hmm. Because you're happy with what you've built, and then those people around you Yeah. Are naturally attracted towards you, you know, and want to be around that. Mm-hmm. Because it's, uh, 

[01:15:02] it's nice, it feels good. It's, it illuminates, you know, because that what you've built is,

[01:15:10] I guess, shines the path to truth. Hmm. Yeah. Beauty is kind of the, the final grade. Hmm. 

[01:15:21] The final grade. Like, how do you mean, like the grade, right? If you look at Totally. And like, you, like, oh, like I, I, you know, I'm heavy, you know, and like. I have anxiety, you know what I mean? Now you look at totally, you are like, oh, shit.

[01:15:33] Like, yo, he used to be that. Now he's this. 

[01:15:35] Mm-hmm. 

[01:15:35] The final grade is the fact that now he's like, he got it. Mm-hmm. He understands the process and he did it. Mm-hmm. For that person, it's like, that's, that's his grade. Mm. Like I like that. Mm-hmm. 

[01:15:45] I 

[01:15:45] like that he got himself out. Now I want that for myself.

[01:15:47] Mm-hmm. 

[01:15:48] So that's your final grade. 

[01:15:50] Mm. 

[01:15:50] As to 

[01:15:52] what you're about right or no? Is it the final grade?

[01:16:03] A lot of people 

[01:16:04] Mike: will look at externally, they wouldn't see the internal 

[01:16:06] Eldar: fine. 

[01:16:06] Mike: You know, let's talk about the beauty that we, we tried 

[01:16:09] Eldar: in this way. The one we're talking about. Yeah. I think so. The true beauty of it all, of course. You know what I mean? The, the, the kindness in someone's eyes. Yeah. You know what I mean?

[01:16:15] The humility in someone's actions. Mm-hmm. You know, the patience in someone's approach, actions approach. Yeah. You know, that's what I'm talking about. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. You know, they were like, oh, wow. Like they're, they. So compassionate or they're so thoughtful. They're so attentive. Mm-hmm. You know, they're so kind.

[01:16:37] You know, like those abilities, those virtues or those qualities of an individual that are illuminating from them because like, it's clear so that the final grade of who the person is and what they've accomplish. Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. We marveled me and you over Tom's thing, right? Mm-hmm. Remember Tom?

[01:16:55] Not out Tom Tom's art? Not that one. Tom from high school. 

[01:17:00] Mike: Oh, from 

[01:17:00] Eldar: high school? Yeah. Remember? Yeah. We always talked about him. Mm-hmm. Like yo, the nicest guy. Yeah. Always humble. Mm-hmm. Always inviting. Like you could speak to him whenever, whatever. He's like, Hey guys. Like, he's always like very nice. Mm-hmm.

[01:17:12] Yeah. That's not by mere chance 

[01:17:14] Mike: no. 

[01:17:14] Eldar: Had to be some kind of upbringing. Yeah. That this motherfucker in high school. Mm-hmm. Where everybody's a gremlin. Everybody's a bully. Everybody's out to get you. Mm-hmm. You know, or you know, snake you mm-hmm. Or be better than you judge you. You know, Tom was always like, Hey, you know?

[01:17:32] Yeah. Like a, A breath of fresh air. 

[01:17:34] Mike: Yeah. 

[01:17:34] Eldar: You know? And what not by chance he's not by it is till this day I remember this. Yeah. I don't remember. There's all the motherfucking gremlins, bro. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I do, but not for the fucking right reasons. Yeah. Yeah. But Tom, I remember, 

[01:17:47] Mike: yeah. You're saying it wasn't boxing, that he's still with the wifey that he, huh?

[01:17:52] It's not boxing that he is with the wifey from high school still. Yeah, I don't think so. He's still with her. Yeah. Yeah. Well, no, I'm saying like, I don't think I was, I know that's boxing. Yeah. I don't think so either. 

[01:18:00] Eldar: You know, I think he was like, he was at that age he was fucking 

[01:18:03] Mike: Yeah. His parents were hippies or something.

[01:18:05] Eldar: Yeah. Something bro. You know? 

[01:18:07] Mike: Yeah. 

[01:18:08] Eldar: But they passed that on to him and he fucking got stuck on this beauty thing. Yeah. You know? Yeah. No, I remember. You know, you don't know what we're talking about, obviously, but he's older, but we fucking know. Right. Yeah, for sure. And I'm sure that if we meet him, he'd probably fucking the same way.

[01:18:23] Yeah. Older with gray hair, probably now, but yeah, probably on that same shit. Same, same personal person. Yeah. You know? Yeah. No matter what the world has thrown, you know, probably at him, he's fucking still that short. I remember like 10 years ago, I bumped into him by the bagel store. He's still like, oh, well, d, you know?

[01:18:39] Mm. Like just like that same fucking energy. Like what the fuck? You know? Sick consistency of character, you know? Yeah. And just as beautiful as I remember him, me, no, Diddy, that's 

[01:18:49] Mike: sick. 

[01:18:49] Eldar: No, 

[01:18:49] Mike: Diddy. 

[01:18:51] Eldar: You know what I'm saying? Yeah. So that's my thing on beauty, that's 

[01:19:00] evergreen. And I think that's what we're after for shit.

[01:19:03] That's evergreen. Yeah. Not the shit that you put on your fucking lips, the fillers or your ass, or your tits. Yeah. Yeah. The shit that sags, it's that spark in your eye. Yeah. Right. It's the, it's the. The window to the soul. Mm. Right. That stays actually, that, that way. 

[01:19:25] Yeah. And then transcends to the next one.

[01:19:29] Alright. Those are my final thoughts guys. What do you got? Yeah, totally on beauty, not on food. 

[01:19:39] Toliy: Yeah. I just feel like in, in general, everyone is trying to figure out how to live a good life. They're obviously doing what they're doing to like, whatever that they believe, whether it's, you know, good or bad, objectively, but subjectively they're trying to figure out like a good way.

[01:19:56] And, um, 

[01:19:57] Eldar: I, I'm gonna push back and say they're trying to figure it out. They're trying, but I'm not sure if they're figuring out anything good. 

[01:20:02] Toliy: Yeah, no, they're, they're, they're trying to figure it out. That's it. That's it. Right. They're, they're like, they, they want their subjective reality to, um, to be good.

[01:20:13] But I feel like the real shift happens is when like. You start to apply your subjective reality into objective. Like, like a, like truth, you know? Yeah. Objective reality. I think that that's the only way for you to get out of whatever you're in, is to, um, figure out ways to apply it towards objective things, because Yeah.

[01:20:36] Life is objective. Yeah. Because then you, you get the opportunity not even guaranteed to get anything, but you get the opportunity to get that question asked. Do you wanna find out? 

[01:20:49] Eldar: Yeah. 

[01:20:49] Toliy: You know, 

[01:20:50] Eldar: that's good. So, 

[01:20:51] Toliy: like, that, that's what I think our, uh, our, our our uh, um, pull a book is a is um, yeah. Is up against, you know?

[01:21:03] Yes. Like, yeah. The question is do you, do you wanna find out? And you could very much you, you could say like, both are valid, yes or no. 

[01:21:13] Eldar: Yeah. You know? Alright. Thank you. This was great as always.